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  •  It does, though, (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cpresley

    add to the appearance of hypocrisy (re: Native American Genocide).

    I don't doubt for a moment that Turkey is behaving advantageously as a result of this resolution.  Where I have an issue is in giving them the opportunity to behave advantageously.  In my opinion, the potential blowback far outweighs whatever value an Armenian Genocide declaration could have garnered.

    •  An Armenian Genocide declaration (4+ / 0-)
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      Euroliberal, RenaRF, virgomusic, BlueTide

      isn't about a cost/benefit analysis. It's about standing by the truth, even if it's unpleasant for an ally who BTW completely denies that the Armenian genocide ever took place (I will at least give the US that just about nobody here, including the government denies the bulk of the genocidal behavior toward the Native Americans).

      You can't refuse to recognize the truth just because there might be blowback.

      The best scenario would've involved this not even coming up right now. But these things don't always work in a way that lets people pick the ideal timing; this has been a battle for a long time. The choice the congress had was to squelch it (again) or pass it.

      •  OMG!! (2+ / 0-)
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        Spit, nathguy

        Please understand that I'm not unhappy with you personally.  Yes, I agree IN THEORY that standing by the truth is absolutely necessary.  In practice, with specific respect to THIS Congress, their track record is ... how do I say it politely ... less than stellar.  Standing by the truth would mean NOT taking impeachment "off the table" (I'm not saying impeach - I'm just saying let the truth dictate whether impeachment is, in fact, on or off the table).  Standing by the truth would mean taking legal action against Gonzales in the AG scandal.  There are so many examples of where this particular Congress has not stood by the truth, the mind boggles.

        Sorry.  To me, this is pure political opportunism and it's definitely going to yield some consequences.  Had they a record of "Standing by the truth" I would give them the benefit of the doubt that they were simply following an established principled course of action.  But they haven't.  And so I find no excuse for heating up and already precarious situation.

        •  No worries (2+ / 0-)
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          RenaRF, dougymi

          it's not personal, I hope you're not taking my argument that way either. Totally not how I mean it.

          It's just IMO a very much more difficult situation than most people on the blogs are considering. I don't entirely care whether it was political opportunism or no -- it remains the truth.

          The situation IMO was just as precarious two weeks ago. Everybody is looking for an excuse to pin some blame for the deteriorating situation somewhere else, and Turkey has been playing this "don't make us angry or we'll do X" game with the US for a long, long time.

          •  Your arguments have been great. (0+ / 0-)

            I was referring more to the OMG!! title of the last comment (mine).  :)

            Here's where I've come down: Given that it's the truth and has been the truth since WWI, it could have been the truth a bit longer when we aren't in an election season and trying not to provide cover to our political enemies.  It's a purist v. strategist question as far as I'm concerned.  I'm thinking like a strategist, and you a (more or less) purist on the issue.  I respect that.

        •  Do you realize that the Armenian genocide (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Euroliberal, RenaRF, nathguy

          is the only one that is being denied not only in Turkey, but in the US by a huge chunk of our media that frames it as a controversial issue based in Armenian claims versus Turkish claims.

          That makes it a genocide unlike any other. our politicians and leaders refuse to cal it a genocide. Bush will call practically anything a genocide if it fits his agenda. Sad to say, Clinton also took the same route. The only genocide that we dare not utter its name is the Armenian one.

          You have to wonder: why is it different? Is it because it was perpetrated by an ally?

          Look at these people! They suck each other! They eat each other's saliva and dirt! -- Tsonga people of southern Africa on Europeans kissing.

          by upstate NY on Tue Oct 16, 2007 at 12:21:44 PM PDT

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          •  I'm sure you're right (0+ / 0-)

            on the overarching question of genocide v. not genocide.  But for God's sake - the resolution accomplished, at best, exactly nothing.  At worst, it managed to give an ailing, hobbled Bush a measure of cover.  Of all the times to press the issue, this was not it, in my opinion.

      •  Go Nancy. The timing is perfect (1+ / 0-)
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        RenaRF

        If Turkey says the US can't use their bases and airspace anymore, it would make it more difficult for Bush-Cheney to conduct the war in Iraq.

        I might just forgive Nancy if this has the desired outcome. Getting us the hell out of Iraq. For fuck's sake, why should Turkey get all pissy over over a non-binding resolution?

        "I think you ought to know I'm feeling very depressed."   —Marvin, The Paranoid Android

        by londubh on Tue Oct 16, 2007 at 12:07:42 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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