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View Diary: A Glimmer of Hope; fees increase on H-1B guest worker Visas (203 comments)

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  •  How much are you paying your current residents? (2+ / 0-)
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    BobOak, uscitizenvoter

    I just wish I could exchange some current residents for them.

    In the argument over the H1B program the term 'the best and brightest' is often used.

    In fact it is often not a case of either 'the best' or 'the brightest' at all.

    What it is in fact is another case of America, and Americans, wanting something for nothing, or wanting to get something at the cheapest possible price -- with the actual quality of what they are being a secondary issue.

    Sure if I am Microsoft, or Google, or Cisco, I am a corporation and I am in it to make profits for my shareholders.

    But there is documented evidence of all these companies getting 1000's of resumes per day.

    All other things being equal, do people actually think that a largely barely out of college 28 year old engineer from any country is going to be better or brighter than a fifty year old engineer from the US?

    I don't think so, but then I'm closer to the latter than the former.

    But I'll tell you what they are. They are cheaper.

    <div style="font-size:10px;text-align:center;background-color:#ffd;color:#f33">If the terriers and bariffs are torn down, this economy will grow - G. Bush

    by superscalar on Mon Oct 29, 2007 at 07:25:25 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Less Than We Pay The Visitors (0+ / 0-)

      ...but then we're not trying to hire a lot of replacement workers, we're trying to hire a few special guest stars.

    •  not always true... (0+ / 0-)

      Although experience comes with age, capability and intelligence have nothing to do with age. To take a personal example, I am doing my PhD (@ Univ of Calif) on a semiconductor material system (Gallium Nitride) that didn't even exist 20 years ago. Again, the fundamental research in this field came out of Japan (and still continues to do so). Besides, your assertion that "50 year old US engineer" is going to be better than a "barely out of college 28 year old", is based on the premise that "all other things are equal", which is seldom the case.

      Lastly, do keep in mind that a lot of Silicon Valley innovation came from "young" minds (think Hotmail, Google, Linux or even Bill Gates/Steve Jobs).

      •  Please take a look at the H1B report I posted (2+ / 0-)
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        BobOak, uscitizenvoter

        Although experience comes with age, capability and intelligence have nothing to do with age.

        And then tell me that 44% of 'the best and brightest' in the world come from India, that sixty-five percent of them are between 25 and 34, that 45% of them have a bachelors degree or less, and 43% of the worlds 'best and brightest' are employed in a computer related field and make $55,000 per year (note this is the median salary).

        Sounds like a Java programmer with one year of experience and no job history to me.

        Note that these figures, as I posted are off from 51%, 65%, and 51% at $46,000 (as I remember).

        <div style="font-size:10px;text-align:center;background-color:#ffd;color:#f33">If the terriers and bariffs are torn down, this economy will grow - G. Bush

        by superscalar on Mon Oct 29, 2007 at 08:02:13 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I was NOT referring to H1B workers.. (1+ / 0-)
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          Duke1676

          .. I know only a small percentage (you would probably know the exact number) are ACTUALLY "high-skilled". For the record, I am from India and know quite a few people (friends and family) who got PhDs in STEM from US universities, and got starting job offers > $90-100K in R&D. As you correctly point out, a lot of H1-B workers (esp in IT field) have only bachelors and/or few years of programming experience -- hardly qualifying as the "best and brightest".

          •  honestly (0+ / 0-)

            Do you believe that Gallium Nitride is only for the young?  What does your adviser think about that if you do?  

            http://blog.noslaves.com

            by BobOak on Mon Oct 29, 2007 at 09:09:00 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  NOT at ALL... (0+ / 0-)

              I am against age discrimination (after all I am going to be older some day). My point was simply that it is not always the case that an older engineer is better than a twenty-something recent grad. I took the specific example just to illustrate that in certain areas most of the people with the required skill set can be quite young. (Of course there are older people as well, including the ones who laid the foundations and the ones in academia/industry).

              •  it was more in jest actually (2+ / 0-)
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                uscitizenvoter, RevenantX

                I figured out that's where you are coming from but on a more serious note, it's shocking how many do not understand that "there for the grace of God go I"
                and also a good STEM, it's lifetime learning and research and that discipline does pay off over time.  So sometimes it matters but certainly the real point of the jest is that age is not a barrier as many try to propagandize.  i.e. they try to send out propaganda that anyone over 35 "can't code" magically, cannot learn, and so forth.  

                http://blog.noslaves.com

                by BobOak on Tue Oct 30, 2007 at 12:40:35 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  yup.... (1+ / 0-)
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                  BobOak

                  ....(Don't tell my adviser about that;-)) funny how people seem to forget the fact that people who are "old" were once "young" and the "young" will eventually become "old". IMHO besides the "old=inflexible" myth, there are HR issues and also the fact that older workers deserve/expect more pay, whereas by contrast it is easier for younger workers to live on smaller salaries (no families, mortgage etc), i.e. employers find it easier to "bargain" with young employees.

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