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View Diary: Zogby "interactive" polls are junk (322 comments)

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  •  Is it just me? (4+ / 0-)

    Or is this the most exhausting primary of all space and time in the universe? We're still a couple months away from the first votes and already we're sorting out multiple rounds of narratives.

    Although, I gotta say, "Hillary is fading" is a very nice narrative.

    Every day's another chance to stick it to The Man. - dls.

    by The Raven on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 07:02:45 AM PST

    •  it is a bunch of things (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      jxg, lanikai, The Raven

      our country has not been under domestic attack by enemies from within for a long time. The last time that any president tried to fuck up the system as royally as Bush has was at the beginning of the last century, when an asshole (since reclaimed and restored by revisionist history) named Woodrow Wilson essentially  pushed forward racism as policy (leading to the KKK sweeping the nation and to deadly lynchings from texas to Duluth, MN) Wilson also passed the Sedition Act, making criticism of him, America or his policies treasonous crimes.
      Wilson, in many ways, was the precursor to George W, and almost as evil.

      That history has rewritten the facts into something unrecognizable should be a lesson for us all. The GOP did it with Reagan, making him seem successful, when he was anything but. Watch them try to do the same with Boy George, starting with karl Rove's rewrite of the historical hysterical rationale that Congress forced Bush into Iraq.

      Ours is a troubled time, making this election that much more interesting, important, and necessary for survival. Hillary represents more of the same, but with pumps and a female suit, but with the identical corporate powers behind her.

      Yes, we are all exhausted, but that is because we care deeply and recognize the cliff in front of us.

      In the United States, doing good has come to be, like patriotism, a favorite device of persons with something to sell. - Mencken

      by agnostic on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 07:16:00 AM PST

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      •  Aside from the silliness of equating Hillary (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        masslib

        with Bush and the sedition act, is this really necessary?

        Hillary represents more of the same, but with pumps and a female suit

        •  given the damage done over the past 7 yrs, (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          The Raven

          many times with the aid and assistance of your candidate, YES, It is really necessary.

          She is a corporate figure who, without marrying well, would not be a candidate for any office, much less president of these untied states, and in particular, during these very trying times.

          Either she voted from fear, ignorance, or because she really supported the Iraq and upcoming Iran invasions and occupations; FISA deformation; Patriot I and I(a);  the hideous, cancerous, and corporatist Bankruptcy law which has created a new class of serfdom in our time; - there are many other objections and examples.

          Give me one example of where she has stood up on a serious constitutional issue for the rights of the little guy. Oh yeah. Banning flag burning.

          Wilson was a pimple on the ass of the Constitution, yet his PR staff and his institute have rehabilitated that racist, misogynist, anti-Bill of RIghts monster into some sort of modern day hero. Here is how the Institute,  the "living monument to Wilson" describes their hero:

          Woodrow Wilson, nicknamed the "schoolmaster in politics," is chiefly remembered for his high-minded idealism, which appeared both in his leadership on the faculty and in the presidency of Princeton University, and in his national and world statesmanship during and after World War I.

          Wilson was born in 1856 in Staunton, Virginia (and named Thomas Woodrow Wilson). He grew up in Georgia and South Carolina during the suffering of the Civil War and its aftermath. He was also deeply influenced by the Presbyterianism of his father, a minister and sometime college teacher.

          They ignore his stomping on rights,  muzzling criticism, and worse.

          The reason that I raise Wilson is that the few Hillary supporters here, those who troll rate anyone raising contrary facts or disagreeing with her positions, use similar language about her as Wilson's organization uses about him. Similar spin, similar revisionism, similar masking of true motivations and bad, even dangerous decisions.

          In the United States, doing good has come to be, like patriotism, a favorite device of persons with something to sell. - Mencken

          by agnostic on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 09:54:00 AM PST

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          •  I was objecting to the "pumps and a female suit" (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            zinger99

            crap, and I was going to let the rest slide.

            Either she voted from fear, ignorance, or because she really supported the Iraq and upcoming Iran invasions and occupations; FISA deformation; Patriot I and I(a);  the hideous, cancerous, and corporatist Bankruptcy law which has created a new class of serfdom in our time; - there are many other objections and examples.

            Of our candidates, only Kucinich voted against war in Iraq, no one voted for war in Iran, only Kucinich voted against the PATRIOT Act, and Clinton did not vote for the bankruptcy bill (assuming you're talking about 2005 an not 2001).

            So your feelings about her should apply nearly equally to all the non-Kucinich candidates.

            The reason that I raise Wilson is that the few Hillary supporters here, those who troll rate anyone raising contrary facts or disagreeing with her positions, use similar language about her as Wilson's organization uses about him.

            No one's troll rating you.  I'm just pointing out the silliness of your argument.

            To equate Clinton with Bush and the sedition act is just plain stupid.

            •  I wasn't talking about the other candidates, (0+ / 0-)

              although we here should now expect her standard defense, "OTHERS DID IT, TOO!" as the motto in any fact-based discussion about Hillary's many problems and issues.
              But since it has been raised, (again), I feel as strongly about every DINO who voted with this administration, without fulfilling  their constitutional tasks as the legislative branch. And for 6 yrs, the whole gaggle of congresscritter geese, and the smelly sty of Senatwhores who have enabled the crimes against the constitution, the crimes against humanity and the war crimes in the middle east, they all deserve a vacation from office, if not a paid vacation to a federally run facility.

              In the United States, doing good has come to be, like patriotism, a favorite device of persons with something to sell. - Mencken

              by agnostic on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 10:14:16 AM PST

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    •  all of us are fading... (0+ / 0-)

      (-8.00,-7.85) "Jesus Christ was the first nonviolent revolutionary." --S. Stills

      by bubbanomics on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 09:42:12 AM PST

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      •  I said exhausting (0+ / 0-)

        I'm tired - but not fading. All we need now is for things to tighten up a bit and the excitement will be back. C'mon Edwards!

        Every day's another chance to stick it to The Man. - dls.

        by The Raven on Wed Nov 28, 2007 at 10:03:47 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

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