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View Diary: Iowa: who the hell knows? (401 comments)

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  •  his point should be and I think is (0+ / 0-)

    that Iowa has too much power, not that Iowan's are worse than anyone else.

    Obama: what was improbable has the chance to beat what Washington said was inevitable.

    by nevadadem on Fri Dec 28, 2007 at 04:38:27 PM PST

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    •  But he never really offers a real alternative (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      IADave

      does he?

      and kind of national primary first would be incredibly expensive and things would end the next day. Same with picking a big state that was more diverse like California.

      The system is rigged - John Edwards

      by okamichan13 on Fri Dec 28, 2007 at 04:43:13 PM PST

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      •  I've offered alternatives (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Asak, Phil S 33, smitha007

        but I know, it's easier to pull things out of your ass than do basic Google research.

        As if the choices are 1) Iowa/NH, 2) national primary, and 3) California.

        Sheesh.

        •  Such a calm response (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Pam from Calif

          and you wonder why things aren't that civil around here?

          since you're here, lay it out for us.

          The system is rigged - John Edwards

          by okamichan13 on Fri Dec 28, 2007 at 05:03:41 PM PST

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          •  here it is (0+ / 0-)

            Divide the nation into 5 distinct areas: West, Midwest, Mid-Atlantic, New England, South.  

            2 randomly selected states from each area would hold their primary on January 15th. That's 10 states on the first primary date.

            another 2 randomly from each area (10 states) would hold their primary on Febuary 15th.

            another 10 states on March 15th.

            another 10 states on April 15th

            and since 40 states have already voted, the final 10 states get to vote on May 15th.

            It's regionally fair and it's also more likely to be representative of Americans than a purely random process that doesn't divide up the country into areas.

            "The American People are not the problem in this country; they are the answer." --Barack Obama

            by ChicagoStudent on Sat Dec 29, 2007 at 01:00:26 AM PST

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      •  National primary (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        spencerh

        with a mandatory spending cap that is publicly financed.  Or a regional rotating primary.

    •  It just bugs me... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      underwhelm, dotster, IADave

      That people always trash Iowa democrats -- implying that if Iowa democrats were from a larger state with a more diverse population we wouldn't stick the party with the so-called "wrong choice." Face it, many democratic activists blamed Iowa for giving the party John Kerry in 2004 instead of their beloved Howard Dean. Many democrats felt that if the first contest was in a more "enlightened" state Dean would of won the nomination. But thats just a flawed theory that unfairly blameed Iowans and slandered them for being narrow-minded and conservative. Face it... Barack Obama wouldn't even have a chance right now to be President if it wasn't for the so-called "undiverse" Iowa Democrats. If the first contest was New York or California Hillary Clinton would be walking away with the nomination right now according to the polls. Iowa at least gives two others a shot...

      •  Well (8+ / 0-)

        Iowa Democrats won't consider anyone who doesn't pander to them on ethanol.

        Really, it's their parochial interests above all else. A more nationally focused primary would force candidates to run on, well, national issues.

        •  not true (6+ / 0-)

          I agree that all the candidates have pandered on ethanol -- but so did the entire United States Congress and the President in the latest farm bill. Its not like support for ethonol subsidies is outside the mainstream of political thought. And trust me, it isn't Iowans own interests above everything else. I've attended lots and lots of candidate events here in Iowa, and most of the issues being talked about, being asked about by potential caucus-goers are the same national issues being talked about everyday on dailykos. Health care, the economy, jobs, War in Iraq. Iowans ask more questions about the War in Iraq then anything and statements about the Iraq War and wanting to end it constantly get the loudest applause because we have a very high per capita number of guard and servicemen over there. To claim that the candidates are not running in Iowa on national issues is silly. National issues is all they talk about. I haven't heard one candidate talk about ethanol in months... I invite you to come to Iowa right now, get on the ground and see the candidates yourself. See the process. Come to Iowa Kos, you can stay at my place, I'll feed you pork chops and corn-bread and you'll come around to seeing my point of view. ;-)

          •  Thank you, smitha007. (0+ / 0-)

            Everything you say about what's been happening here in Iowa is exactly on target.  I - and a whole lot of other Iowans - loathe what the ethanol industry is doing, to Iowa and to the world. I, too, have been attending as many candidate events as I can, to get an up-close sense of what each candidate is like - and to an event, as you say, comments on the Iraq incursion generate the greatest response.  And Markos, if you get tired of smitha007's place, c'monna my house, where I'll serve some fine enchiladas and/or vegetarian . . . especially if you bring those beautiful babies with you.

          •  I concur (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Headlight

            The candidates do the pandering.  The urban population of Iowa doesn't give a crap about ethanol, and it's the bulk of the population here.  By urban I'm including anything at least 100,000 in population - so we're not talking Chicago or even Minneapolis.  Nevertheless, the caucusing population is VERY attuned to national and international issues.  I've gone to a bunch of campaign events and ethanol is mentioned once in a very blue moon.

            I've only been in Iowa for ten years, by the way.  Lived 18 years in San Diego, have lived in South America, New York City, DC, St. Louis, and Providence.  So I have a good basis for comparing the wide-ranging interests of Iowans with those of people in bigger cities.

        •  Ethanol? (0+ / 0-)

          This seems like a pretty small issue to be the basis of concern about Iowa being parochial.  The people who participate in the caucuses are certainly more in tune with agriculture issues than the vast majority of Americans, but it seems from the coverage I hear that the war and national issues are also very big there.  It isn't like there is a huge anti-ethanol constituency in the country that are struggling to be heard over the din of the Iowa campaign.  

          In any case, I don't understand the reference to a "nationally focused primary."  Wouldn't a primary national in scope be far less focused?  Perhaps the strongest argument for a national campaign and against starting in Iowa or another state where the candidates actually spend time talking to the voters is that the substantive nature of campaigning in Iowa is totally different than the vacuous national campaigns where the race is decided by whether a person wears a funny hat in a tank, whether a candidate yells at a rally, or whether a decorated veteran's official record is as reliable as the memories of a bunch of embittered partisan veterans out to smear him.  

      •  Giving others a shot ... (0+ / 0-)

        Obama has been nationally competitive in fundraising, and in the spring he nearly overtook Hillary in national polling.

        If we had a national primary, campaigns strategies would be different, and there's no basis to say that Obama, or Edwards, couldn't be competitive in the national polls.

        What I don't like about the Iowa-NH process is that it cedes enormous control over our nomination to what amount to a couple of big media focus groups.

        The best fortress is to be found in the love of the people - Niccolo Machiavelli

        by al Fubar on Fri Dec 28, 2007 at 05:13:49 PM PST

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