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View Diary: Is Obama's Reagan comment his Dean Scream? w/poll (176 comments)

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  •  I think you missed my point... n/t (0+ / 0-)
    •  No I didn't. I disagree with your point. (1+ / 0-)
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      Iberian

      My point, you missed, because we seem to be to some extent talking past each other, is that although I am old enough to remember both Reagan and Goldwater, that if Obama had made a speech talking about Goldwater as a transformative politician, it wouldn't have hit me like his speech where he showed that he felt that Reagan's methods were acceptable.  Goldwater was an honest politician by and large.  And there are historians who argue that Goldwater and his ideas transformed his party, which then transformed the country.  Unfortunately the ideas of Goldwater which they picked up on were the ones about taxes and starving government and bellicosity being a good thing.  But Goldwater's ideas were not what the country wanted, and because Goldwater was explicit about what those ideas were, he was not elected.

      I think that's a good thing, and I respect Goldwater but do not agree with a lot of Goldwater's ideas.  (although he was spot on on civil rights and freedom from religion).

      Obama doesn't subscribe to what he views as a lot of Reagan's ideas, but he obviously approves of what he thinks Reagan did to draw the country together.  Reagan's methods, he approves of.  I strongly do not approve of Reagan's methods.

      Either one of two things are true:

      1.  Obama believes that what he calls the 'excesses of the 60's and 70's' were excesses.  Here's what were & perhaps are commonly viewed by Reagan democrats/republicans as the excesses of the 60's & 70's :the rise of civil rights for women and blacks (and if you read Goldwater,a 60's figure, the start of rights for gays).  The rejection of corporal punishmenbt for children.  The limiting of religion in schools and public ceremonials.  You're thinking sex and drugs, but the Reagan democrat/republican, while he would probably put them in his list at the bottom of the list really didn't like the things I mentioned a lot more.
      1.  He doesn't.

      In case one, he's an honest politician, but I don't agree and I reject him but respect him.

      In case two, he's practicing the methods of Reagan to deceive his listeners, and I reject him and don't respect him either.

      In case two, he's using the methods of Reagan.  In 1980, it took a chaotic time coupled with an empty suit with a charming platform manner.  Now one does not need to be an empty suit to charm on the platform.  Obama is not an empty suit, but Reagan sure was.  He would tell any lie if it was what people wanted to hear.  And he could look genuine and honest while he did it (Duh.  He was an actor and the MSM sold him to people as authentic, would you believe?) Goldwater wouldn't.

      So which is it do think with Obama?

      There really is no third choice.  The 'well, well Obama will put in good policies and Reagan put in bad policies' defense won't fly with me.  The problem is whether the ends justifies the means or not.  For me, not.

      For you, yes, apparently.

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