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View Diary: On Trade, A Stark Difference Between Edwards And Obama (198 comments)

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  •  Except ... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    baronzito, Justanothernyer, clambake

    ... they'd also be shipping a ton up here.  Asparagus, I know, is a huge Peruvian crop.  

    I guess I'd like to know where y'all would like American farmers to ship their goods.

    "Live each week like it's Shark Week." -- Tracy Jordan

    by Adam B on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 02:43:12 PM PST

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    •  And getting in return...? (7+ / 0-)

      If you only grow crops for export and you don't make enough profit you've just radically shifted the model of subsistance agriculture.

      Unless there's a plan in place to help deal with that one I'm dubious as to whether this helps or hurts.

      "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

      by grannyhelen on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 02:47:03 PM PST

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    •  So the giant agribusiness makes money (6+ / 0-)

      but the farmer goes to the city to eke out a living.

      How about growing the asparagus here?  That is the global movement to grow your food nearby.

      It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin

      by pioneer111 on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 02:48:17 PM PST

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    •  This is what I'm talking about... (12+ / 0-)

      However, a recent study by GRADE, a Lima-based public policy research institute, predicts that the poorest of the poor-Quechua and Aymara subsistence farmers in the rural highlands-will suffer rather than benefit from the trade deal. Although Peru’s economy as a whole will enjoy a $417 million increase in its first year, these gains will be directed almost exclusively at the urban sector, which will benefit by $575 million, whereas the rural sector will lose $158 million. [1] The findings of this report echo impact analyses conducted in Colombia and Ecuador, who are negotiating similar FTAs with the US. [2]

      link: http://www.twnside.org.sg/...

      What is the plan to deal with those communities who lose out?

      "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

      by grannyhelen on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 02:58:14 PM PST

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      •  Read the underlying report (3+ / 0-)

        Referenced in Footnote 1, and I'm glad I can read Spanish.  There's a 800M soles (about $300M U.S.) compensation fund over five years for farmers affected by US imports.

        "Live each week like it's Shark Week." -- Tracy Jordan

        by Adam B on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 03:10:46 PM PST

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        •  I can't... (5+ / 0-)

          ...and is there evidence that this is enough to offset the total affect this has on displaced substinence farmers?

          Again - the question - what do they do next?

          "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

          by grannyhelen on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 03:26:59 PM PST

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          •  Read your own link (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Justanothernyer

            "whereas the rural sector will lose $158 million."

            "Live each week like it's Shark Week." -- Tracy Jordan

            by Adam B on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 03:35:42 PM PST

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            •  Yes...the rural sector will lose $158 million (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Predictor, lenzy1000, priceman

              Where do these poor farmers go?

              "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

              by grannyhelen on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 04:04:36 PM PST

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              •  That's why there's a compensation fund. NT (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                clambake

                "Live each week like it's Shark Week." -- Tracy Jordan

                by Adam B on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 04:06:33 PM PST

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                •  over five years... (6+ / 0-)

                  What happens after five years?

                  "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

                  by grannyhelen on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 04:13:16 PM PST

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                  •  Free Raid Agreements (0+ / 0-)

                    Congratulations grannyhelen, you win this round by default.  And you raise a crucial question --  where is sustainability in the equation?  Peru has worked very hard to redevelop organic cotton and alpaca fiber production.  If we want to help them, and ourselves at the same time, we should foster cooperative joint ventures between organic cotton and alpaca producers on both sides of the equator, subsidize the science required, and support development of locally added value to the raw materials.

                    A Japanese friend took it upon herself to go into small villages in Chile to teach fiber related skills, and found that all of her classes were swamped with people eager to develop entrepreneurial skills.  When we focus on people as resources and make a commitment to enabling them, the energy and motivation are incredible.  This is very different from industrial production of asparagus.

                    Free Trade actually means Free Raid -- corporations taking everything possible from people, including their environment, communities, and personal viability.  It can happen in Peru, but the fate is no less ours.

                    John Edwards sees that and speaks truth.  Cooperation between the people of Peru and the US is a good thing, from which we can all learn and grow.  But we need to approach those relationships without the taint of a corporate agenda.  Edwards is our man -- the only hope, which is why we are so tenacious in supporting him.  Go John!

                    The Shock Doctrine by Naomi Klein -- best book ever, I nominate for a Nobel Prize!

                    by xaxado on Tue Jan 22, 2008 at 05:52:12 PM PST

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    •  americans (6+ / 0-)

      should be producing local food for americans. as should hte peruvians.

      Dole and Green Giant moved their shipping asparagus canning factories to Peru. a lot of folks in Washington state and Oregon lost their jobs. both the farmers and the canning factories, as Peru offers lower labor and enviro costs. all so we can ship it back to the US.

    •  I'm with you on this one (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Adam B, dnta

      though I know anything smacking of free trade is extremely unpopular here.  It needs to be done carefully to include environmental and labor provisions to ensure corporations don't exploit the cheaper labor, but in principle the free market lifts all boats by more efficiently allocating resources.  Fix market failures rather than shut the door.  Absolutely do not subsidize American companies taking jobs overseas - that is the greater distortion and more harmful phenomenon.

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