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View Diary: Majority Voices Support for Hillary (163 comments)

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  •  Yes they are positive (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kathygo, Gabriele Droz

    And I can say the opposite for Barack, and I don't mean positive vs negative. He always works his 2002 speech about Iraq into every discussion of foreign affairs that he can.  And yes that is wise of him, because then he doesn't need to spend time going toe to toe with Hillary on all of the current foreign policy and national security issues facing America. The past presents no new challenges.

    •  The past (0+ / 0-)

      is prelude to the future.

      I can't make judgments on very many forgiven policy issues. I simply don't have enough facts. I judge on the issues I know.

      Iraq is a war that never should have be fought or authorized. Hillary authorized it.

      It is ironic that you would be so dismissive of the past given that your candidate is now getting endorsements from the dead.

      We shall overcome, someday. Yes we can.

      by Sam Wise Gingy on Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 08:54:22 AM PST

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      •  So you consider it an endorsement? (0+ / 0-)

        I consider it a tribute and a reminder.

        But then, I knew Ann.

      •  My post was not dismissive of the past (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        My point was narrow but still important. The past is static, the present is fluid, and the future is unknown. By all means learn lessons from the past, Hillary Clinton certainly does. But be fully engaged in the present and prepared for the future also. Hey my car has a rear view mirror and I use it often, very helpful. But I look out the windshield more often when deciding where to turn next.

        Giving a great speech in a local district that was strongly opposed to any conflict with Iraq was not a profile in courage. Obama was correct and John Kerry and Joe Biden were wrong, but John Kerry and Joe Biden and Hillary Clinton had a lot more to weigh than Obama did. He didn't vote on the IWR, but he won votes with that speech.

        •  Obama was right (0+ / 0-)

          Hillary was wrong.

          You wouldn't let Bush say that those who opposed him on Iraq weren't president at the time and if they were, they would have lied too.

          Why do you give immunity rather than responsibility to Hillary Clinton by virtue of her position in the senate?

          We shall overcome, someday. Yes we can.

          by Sam Wise Gingy on Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 09:17:34 AM PST

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          •  I give her the same responsibility I give (0+ / 0-)

            to John Edwards, John Kerry, Chris Dodd and Joe Biden. The IWR got the U.N. inspectors back into Iaq as planned. They all should have trusted George W. Bush less that he would actually let them do there job once they got there.

            •  They all were WRONG (0+ / 0-)

              Obama was right.

              Holding office does not mean that you aren't responsible for your decisions and you don't get a pass just because your peers were wrong.

              We shall overcome, someday. Yes we can.

              by Sam Wise Gingy on Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 10:12:57 AM PST

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              •  Obama has made mistakes too (0+ / 0-)

                He will make more mistakes in the future. Human beings are not infallible. The war vote at one time was a deal breaker for me too, but we have to be realistic and move on, because there is NO going back.  A LOT of people made that mistake--the MAJORITY of Americans supported our invasion of Iraq, did you forget? People make mistakes. If we demand ideological purity, we won't have anyone left. And we will certainly never end the divisiveness. I hope Obama has a good plan for uniting all the people his supporters have cast off.

                •  Why should I settle for a candidate that was (0+ / 0-)

                  wrong on Iraq when there is one I like more who was right on Iraq?

                  And Iraq ain't all there is neither.

                  There is all of that Clinton baggage. In spite of all of his qualities and accomplishments, Bill Clinton did disgrace his party, office and country by using his position to get sexual favors.

                  There is the rotten negative campaign the Hillary has and is running. I know lies and empty attacks when I see them and apparently so do many other voters.

                  We shall overcome, someday. Yes we can.

                  by Sam Wise Gingy on Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 10:25:37 AM PST

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                  •  Can I ask you (0+ / 0-)

                    how old you are? I'm not being snarky, I'm just wondering if our seeing things so differently is a generational thing; and if it is, how we go about bridging the gap.

                    •  50s (0+ / 0-)

                      Old enough to know a political phenomena when I see one.

                      I was a little kid when Kennedy came on the stage and that was the first name of a politician I can remember knowing.

                      I was 10 or so when I heard the I have a dream speech. My family was racist. I still remember the sense of awe I had when I heard that speech and I knew MLKJ was speaking the truth.

                      I was in junior high when MLKJ was killed and remember going to sleep afraid that rioters would come to my neighborhood.

                      A few months later RFK got shot and I can still remember the pain.

                      There hasn't been any one like JFK, RFK, and MLKJ that I  liked since, until Obama.

                      When someone like Obama comes along all you can do is pray they are on your side. Thank God he is.

                      If Obama was a Republican (God knows he couldn't be) then this election would be over.

                      We shall overcome, someday. Yes we can.

                      by Sam Wise Gingy on Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 10:51:02 AM PST

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                      •  Okay, it's not generational (0+ / 0-)

                        since we are in the same age group, and shared similar experiences in our early years of political awareness. There is plenty that I like about Obama, but his thin resume concerns me and he hasn't been able to explain it away to my satisfaction. I think the GOP attack machine will make mincemeat of him, figuratively speaking, and I also worry about his physical safety, because we have NOT overcome. If he is our nominee, I will of course support him despite my misgivings-- and honestly--I'm not blinded by any light here--I have misgivings about Hillary too, but after much deliberation, I have decided that her life experience makes her the better qualified candidate of what we have left to navigate the international clusterfuck the Bush cabal has created. I'm afraid McCain will get my kid (a soldier) killed. I don't know that Hillary or Obama WON'T, but life is about hard choices and trying your best to choose wisely. I won't deny that Obama has something special, but I don't know that it's what we need RIGHT NOW to get us out of the very deep crap we're in.  My experience in politics and life has taught me that you don't always get what you want, and you aren't always gong to like your choices. I can understand young people, or older ones who have never been involved in politics before, catching and riding this inspirational wave of hopefulness (not a bad thing) because political reality hasn't dumped cold water all over them yet. What's your excuse? :)  And I for all the world want  the younger generation to take the reins and show us all a better way to do things; but if they think they can do it by throwing all the older folks under the bus because we don't know nuthin, then they're on the path to handicapping themselves and losing that bright shiny hope.

                        •  The view from under the bus (0+ / 0-)

                          is really not all that bad.

                          The times they are a changin and IMO none to soon. After all our generation gave them GWB and the invasion of Iraq.

                          I hear in the Obama movement a new generation coming of age and claiming ownership politically.

                          If HRC had the same appeal to the young and formerly disenfranchised then I would have a very tough choice. But Obama reaches people. I think Hillary could probably twist a few more arms and optimize the office of the presidency better, but IMO she won't have the same mandate behind her that Obama will. IMO that will more than make up for Obama's inexperience.

                          We shall overcome, someday. Yes we can.

                          by Sam Wise Gingy on Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 01:53:00 PM PST

                          [ Parent ]

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