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View Diary: Morris, Oklahoma. Pop: 1,319 (126 comments)

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  •  My assertion is that a group whose (4+ / 0-)

    primary purpose is religious indoctrination and proselytization should not receive public money, regardless of how much good they might do. And that we should err on the side of withholding the money.

    What's so hard about Peace, Love, and Truth and Progress?

    by melvin on Wed Jul 02, 2008 at 09:32:05 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  That's a good argument (5+ / 0-)

      But it's where we disagree.

      There are plenty of religious institutions that do not regularly proselytize. I think I read once, for example, that rabbis are taught to turn away prospective converts to Judaism three times before they will agree to talk to them about it.

      The shortest complete sentence in the English language is a raised middle finger, aimed at the appropriate party.

      by droogie6655321 on Wed Jul 02, 2008 at 09:38:37 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Well Judaism in general has never been (4+ / 0-)

        big on proselytizing, nor are some other groups.

        But at the bottom of this I don't see why religious groups should be advantaged over the chess club, or a film buff's society. It is granting them moral authority, advancing their claim on moral authority, and that should not be the function of the state.

        What's so hard about Peace, Love, and Truth and Progress?

        by melvin on Wed Jul 02, 2008 at 09:42:50 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Well, I dunno (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MsWings

          I mean, in theory I guess an organization like the YMCA could have a chess club or something.

          Anyway, I don't think it's about moral authority. It's about charity. And we have hundreds of thousands of religious institutions throughout the country that are already set up and equipped to do charity work.

          To me it's better to support them in their efforts rather than attempt to reinvent the wheel through another government program.

          The shortest complete sentence in the English language is a raised middle finger, aimed at the appropriate party.

          by droogie6655321 on Wed Jul 02, 2008 at 09:45:35 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  btw, (0+ / 0-)

          I could more likely see this in a monoglot, monocultural society. But here it just seems to open such a can of worms.

          What's so hard about Peace, Love, and Truth and Progress?

          by melvin on Wed Jul 02, 2008 at 09:52:51 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Not in the last 1700 years or so. But (0+ / 0-)

          before Christianity became the official religion of the Roman Empire, followed by the outlawing of non-Christian proselytism, Jews did proselytize.

        •  In my experience (0+ / 0-)

          There haven't been any chess clubs or film buff societies clamoring for an opportunity to serve their fellow man via a food pantry or homeless shelter. It's the sort of activity that churches seem drawn to. And, actually, most (at least pre-Bush initiative) are drawn to it because they see a need to "walk their talk" by helping the poor and not because they seek a captive audience to proselytize. (Before the Bush initiative they weren't allowed to proselytize, so there wouldn't have been much point if that were their motivation.)

          "My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." Sen Carl Schurz 1872

          by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 02, 2008 at 11:56:30 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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