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View Diary: Russ Feingold asks you to "Stand with the Constitution." (284 comments)

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  •  That part is false! (0+ / 0-)

    This FISA legislation gives enormous powers to the government: including the ability to read emails and text messages and listen to phone conversations of anyone communicating with their family members, friends, associates, reporters, ANYBODY who may be overseas – all with zero court review.  Nobody should be supporting this legislation.

    The bill itself expressly states that warrants for wiretaps are to be reviewed and then granted by the FISA Court.

    •  Why would they (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      slinkerwink

      overstate it? I believe you,slinker, and think it is not helpful to have this hyperbole attached to the debate.

      Seems deceitful to me.

    •  I think that (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      AmericanRiverCanyon, priceman

      what's being discussed there is that communication with an overseas party can be monitored without warrant if the monitoring target is the overseas person and that person is not a US citizen.  It's just that, according to the proposed law, the real government target can't be the in-country side of the communication - ie. reverse targeting - that would require a warrant.  

    •  Did we read the same bill ? (14+ / 0-)

      ... did you bother to listen to what Pelosi and Hoyer said about it?

      Once again, for those people deliberately ignoring the problems with the bill, it's not that the government is spying on us. Of course the government is spying on us.  The problem is that the government is giving a government function to private enterprise under the guise of outsourcing, to prevent oversight and gain political influence by making the telecoms part of their network.

      Now, there's all sorts of issues with this, and here is the primary one, parts of Congress feel obligated to write bills covering up and granting retroactive immunity to Business Corporations who were initating this illegal spying before 9/11.  
      They are doing it to cover their a$$es and for campaign contributions.

      They are violating the Constitution by treating one class of citizen better than another class. They are vacating their obligation to provide oversight. They should be ashamed of themselves.

      Who provides oversight when spying is done by data miners paid by the telecoms to harvest private consumer information which is then in turn sold to the government?  Telecoms are a business. They run on the principle of creating a profit, not on the principle of following any law. Will they massage the data stream to make themselves more money, giving the Republicans what they would like to see the most? Of course.  They now attempt to write our laws and gut the Bill of Rights, and you sit there and try to defend this?

      As for other people here advocating for this junk, and pretending the bill doesn't do this, on the pretext that they must get "their" candidate elected at all costs, think twice the next time you leap into the arms of the most unpopular and law breaking President in History.  

    •  asfd (3+ / 0-)

      The bill itself expressly states that warrants for wiretaps are to be reviewed and then granted by the FISA Court.

      So does the original FISA bill, but the problem is that Bush has decided to ignore that little obstacle.  I don't know why anyone thinks he will obey a reaffirmation of a law he is already ignoring.

      OWW4O
      (Old White Woman 4 Obama)
      OWW40's Unite!

      by Cyber Kat on Thu Jul 03, 2008 at 12:35:52 PM PDT

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    •  until denied... (5+ / 0-)

      7 days to FISA court. If the court denies the warrant, it can be appealed. While going through the process, information can continue to be collected.

      If at the END of the appeal process the warrant is not issued, the info collected MAY BE KEPT.

      FISA warrants rejected under the current law...

      "All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent."T.J.

      by smkngman on Thu Jul 03, 2008 at 12:53:56 PM PDT

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    •  Scope (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      NonnyO, Orange County Liberal

      You're seriously misunderestimating the scope of what they've been doing. This isn't about a few hundred wiretaps without warrants. They've monitoring everything.
      All of us.
      Everything.

      Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world.

      by cybersaur on Thu Jul 03, 2008 at 08:07:19 PM PDT

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    •  sinkerwink, it short-sheets review. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      NonnyO

      The Administration can pursue all sorts of data collection on a general warrant - that's not what's allowed under the Fourth Amendment or the current FISA statute.

      It grossly shifts the balance of power to the executive, away from the judiciary.

      Ceux qui peuvent vous faire croire à des absurdités peuvent vous faire commettre des atrocités.

      by Orange County Liberal on Thu Jul 03, 2008 at 10:58:01 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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