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View Diary: Senator Buyer?  Senator Daniels? (312 comments)

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  •  Gore was a DLC'er (0+ / 0-)

    I'm not disputing your facts.

    I'm speaking from a longer term view. In the 1980s and 1990s, Gore was indeed a DLC'er, and he was one when he ran for VP in 1992 and 1996.

    Bill Clinton changed the focus of the DLC, and he was the most successful politician from that school of political thought.

    That's essentially my argument about Bayh. Might be a DLC'er, but as VP, he'll have the power to influence that faction of the party and he will undoubtedly influence it under the leadership of Barack Obama.

    Gore's evolution is an example of my argument. If we're worried about 2016, then let's fight that battle then. We need to have the DLC on our side right now, and for at least the next three years.

    I did support Obama's FISA vote. I'm with Keith Olberman and John Dean on that one. The law as it exists allows criminal prosecution and only provides immunity from civil lawsuits.

    No doubt, when the criminals are finally tried, they will try to point to this law as an indication that Congress condones the actions taken. But be of good cheer. That law has been immediately challenged legally by the ACLU.

    Obama's vote was like the other votes: a bid to take the issue off the table for the November election. A bitter pill to swallow, but unfortunately necessary if we are going to get to the point where we can take action against the crooks.

    I'm not a big fan of these kinds of compromises, and I regularly attack them, as everyone should. What's the alternative?

    •  I don't think (0+ / 0-)

      John Dean supported Obama on the FISA vote. Neither did KO actually, I think he was being cautious to undermine since he's on TV and he's our only serious progressive presence on TV.

      DLC as a label means diddly. DLC as in policy/positions is what matters and they have been especially horrible and unacceptable since 2001.

      Once can say that Gore was sort of a DLC dude in his 1988 run. But, I'd take even that 39 year old DLC Gore over DLC/neocon Bayh of any time. Don't even think of compaign Gore of 2000 or now with that chump.

      "That's essentially my argument about Bayh. Might be a DLC'er, but as VP, he'll have the power to influence that faction of the party and he will undoubtedly influence it under the leadership of Barack Obama."

      That's not realistic thinking. if you paid attention to what Bayh has been doing on war and civil liberties (see my sigline diary) and on smearing progressive Dems (like Dean, and the primary-time version of Obama), the only logical conclusion is that is Bayh is going to try and influence anyone, it will be Obama towards the McCain/Lieberman/neocon direction of foreign policy, and the DLC/corporatist on domestic/economic policy. Obama is already vulenrable to making compromises benind towards rightwing, and having Bayh as his numero duo would be the worst possible scenario. We need a progressive like Reed pulling Obama towards the progressive (and hence most of the time logical, rational and common sense) side.

      •  Well, you talk a good game (0+ / 0-)

        And you're a fellow lefty.

        I have to heed what you say because you're pretty darn convincing, but I still think my point of view bears some consideration.

        Call me on the fence, OK? You've given me pause over my previous arguments.

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