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View Diary: Big Business Goes After Unions to Defeat Democrats (327 comments)

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  •  Son of a Bitch (2+ / 1-)
    Recommended by:
    hippykicker, oaktownadam
    Hidden by:
    unionsally

    I posted a comment this morning on this subject and it's gone - we delete comments we don't like now here at DKOS?

    I have a Merit Shop - and I'll support the EFCA if and only if the legislation (I've told my Senator this face to face) the same card check works if your employees want to leave the union. The Union, according to the Department of Labor has the worst record on wage and hour violations.

    This is a democracy last time I checked...and if want the EFCA then is should also include the right to de-unionize...otherwise you've given the Unions the upper and hand and damn near a monopoly. This is a change for checks and balances...not just one sided legislation.l

    In this election, the economy has no color

    by Arkydem on Sun Aug 24, 2008 at 10:53:17 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  your comment was deleted because (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Special K

      The Union, according to the Department of Labor has the worst record on wage and hour violations.

      you are posting inflamatory nonsense. Back up your claims, and maybe you wont get hide-rated. In the meantime, here's another donut for ya...

    •  Your comment was not removed (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Special K, rockhound, unionsally

       it is still there, but was hidden.

       Merit shop is an Orwellian phrase that implies union shops are full of workers who somehow lack merit, or are lazy. Try "non union shop" instead. It is much more descriptive.

       Unionized workers can indeed already call for a decertification election if they so desire. It's the law. So quit harping about that.

       The present election process is a sham. Even if the union is certified as the bargaining agent for the employees, the employer has no incentive to bargain--at all! The election means nothing. The entire process is heavily slanted in favor of employers who can drag the process out, fire union organizers with impunity, hire unionbusting law firms to intimidate workers, and then ignore the results of the election.

       Does that sound like a fair process to you?

       The right to belong to a union is just that--a right. It is not a contest between employees and their employer.

       Why are you afraid of unions? Union workers are better trained. Union shops have less turnover, so their more--experienced workers are more productive. A worker with better job security and compensation, both hallmarks of unionization, is more likely to feel he has a stake in the company. If you own a business, I'm sure you know that such a person is going to generate more profit for your company.

       Lighten up, and stick around. I'm sure you'll learn something here.

      What's the difference between Vietnam and Iraq? Bush knew how to get out of Vietnam.

      by happy camper on Sun Aug 24, 2008 at 11:14:06 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I'm from a union family (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        oaktownadam

        my old man's job is what fed the family. This was 40 years ago -

        Now - here's a lesson for those that might be open minded enough to look at the other side.

        Suppose my employees decide they want a union - most small to medium shops don't have the resources to hire some union busting high dollar attorney.

        Here's your options; agree to the union and face the real prospect of losing your business - I know, you're gonna disagree. Well here's the real deal. You bid work - you bid work on the cost of materials and labor. Now you've been unionized and your labor costs go up, say 28%. Your competitor - the guy you been battling for years over pennies per sq. ft. - we'll he's not quite big enough for the union organizers to go after.

        You go head to head with this guy the next day...and guess who wins the bid - the lowest bidder - my competitor. I can't do jack doo doo about it. This happens for a year maybe two, my business drys up - I go deeper into debt trying to hang on - I lay off folks - it's a right to work state - and all the time, my competitors gets bigger and bigger - the union catches up with him - and his competitor becomes the beneficiary of my competitor being unionized. I've seen this too may times - there isn't a business in my industry that can survive and absorb an increase in costs when his competitors don't have to play in the same ballpark.

        The other option - when you know that you're going to be unionized. Shut her down - form a new corporation (happens all the time).

        And here in MHO is the dirty little secret in my industy (construction). It's not the General Contractor, the Subcontractors or anybody who actually is building the project - it's the OWNERS who decide if the job will be a union or non-union job. The unions have made the contractors the big bad wolves, when in fact it's the owners - everytime I hear the the union is picketing a job site - I laugh - the Owners have successfully used the contractors as their shield - and they'll take the lowest price, regardless of the ethics or whose doing the work - they want the most for the least -and that's not the union, ya want to picket, picket the parent company that's building the building.

        That my friend is why many of my fellow brethren fear the union - I don't - they do - and until the playing field is the same - they got a right to fear it.

        You can aruge with me and give me a million reasons to tell me that I'm dead wrong, that these aren't the real facts. We'll, it's the facts on the ground and the fear is real for these business's owners who have put  their lives and hearts into their businesses.

        If these are not the facts, well then the unions have done a damn poor job of letting the business community know what the feature/benefits of having a union are and for damn sure the owners and end consumers need an education.

        In this election, the economy has no color

        by Arkydem on Sun Aug 24, 2008 at 12:10:50 PM PDT

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        •  still waiting for you to post those links (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Special K, happy camper

          showing how unions are the worst violaters of wage and hour laws. something tells me I shouldnt hold my breath....right?

          •  I'm on it (0+ / 0-)

            I heard it when I was in Washington last month.

            And it is interesting that you've made no attempt to comment on the points and realities of my comment. Interesting indeed.

            In this election, the economy has no color

            by Arkydem on Sun Aug 24, 2008 at 03:05:32 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

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