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View Diary: Experience Argument Hurting Palin And The Other Dude (334 comments)

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  •  I don't see (13+ / 0-)

    how last night's speech played to anyone but the Republican base.  Honestly.  I will be very interested to see if they do focus group polling on the speech itself -- they don't usually do this for VP candidates, I don't think, I don't remember one for Biden, but you can bet they will for Sarah Palin -- and what the results of that speech were.

    ChrisR had a very good (albeit brief) diary last night that I agreed with wholeheartedly: it was a good speech for luring in those who already agreed with the Republican platform, but there was very little there to bring in anyone who was unpersuaded by the red meat.

    -- Stu

    •  That sounds right to me. (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      sdf, marrael, dnn
    •  To put it rather crudely, (22+ / 0-)

      Palin was an affirmative action pick, not for women, but for the religious right.  They would be thrilled to have one of their in office.  I think that cannot be overstated: thrilled.

      And Palin is the real thing, in their eyes.

      But the same characteristics that attract them will turn off everyone else.

      I think the trade here is pretty obvious, and that McCain or his people made it knowingly.

      •  Oh God please let those rumors of adultery (9+ / 0-)

        be true. I want this woman's political future ruined.

        McCain - Worse than Bush

        by MAORCA on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:21:13 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  That is the most frightening thing (12+ / 0-)

        that she's an honest to goodness fungelical.  I mean, yeah, Dubya says he's one, but he seems like he's as phony and half-hearted with that as he is with everything else in his life.  She's the real deal, and she could, in fact, be our president.  How scary is that?

        -- Stu

      •  small town America (8+ / 0-)

        may see her differently

        having moved from big cities on the West Coast into a small town in Eastern Kentucky, I watched Palin last night and saw in her mannerisms, her word choices, and her persona the same characteristics I see in many of the strong women I have come to know here.

        As profoundly insulting as their orchestrated attacks on community organizers were last night, we will want to be careful not to demean what it means to be a small town mayor. Which is a far thing from suggesting it qualifies one to be VP, but it is the nature of the American dream to hope and believe in the kind of escalator Palin has taken. Denying that dream, diminishing the challenges and competencies of rural America...we do that to our peril.

        For the first time, last night, I thought we could lose this election. We shouldn't, but she's going to be tough in places this community rarely seems to understand.

        Beware all ventures which require new clothes, and not a new wearer of clothes. -- Henry David Thoreau

        by Shocko from Seattle on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:23:54 AM PDT

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        •  Point taken. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          bigjacbigjacbigjac

          Dems will have to think on that.

        •  You could be correct. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Glic, Hillbilly Dem, hideinplainsight

          Of course, we need to become smarter than that small town view.  But you may be right about millions of voters who live in small towns or have roots there, and feel that small town wisdom is smarter than anything else.  Mayberry still feels good.

          •  Mayberry does feel good. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            hideinplainsight

               The rub is in how it's presented. Most Mayberryites love their little hamlet, but would not want to see their mayor, who can't get that pothole fixed, be the President of the United States.

          •  I'm grew up in a small town the same size as (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            marrael, hideinplainsight

            Wasilla was when Palin was mayor.  I guess there were some nuggets of wisdom hiding somewhere, but I sure didn't stumble across it.  I didn't even realize how ignorant I was of so many things until I left that small town for a liberal arts college in Manhattan.  

            I guess if you grew up in a small town and never left it, Palin would appeal.  If you ever ventured out of that small town for any length of time, I think she might be offensive, as she is for me.

            "a sign of a totalitarian state, of a dictatorship, when people did not question what their government did." Howard Zinn

            by dnn on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:54:10 AM PDT

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            •  Ugh, "I grew up", not "I'm grew up". (0+ / 0-)

              Started phrasing a difft way & forgot to change the orig word.

              "a sign of a totalitarian state, of a dictatorship, when people did not question what their government did." Howard Zinn

              by dnn on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:55:02 AM PDT

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            •  The point - most of them never have and never wil (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              slinkerwink

              leave that small town as you did.

              I revisited my small-town college fifteen years after I had graduated and where I had lived as a "townie" rather than a dorm student.

              EVERYONE I had known in town from my student years was still there doing the same job they had when I had left.  While the college grew into a major university, the town had stood still.

              Those are the people whose mentality and perception we need to be careful about.

        •  True. Palin was a small town mayor (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Glic

          who got paid $75,000 and had to hire an administrator because she couldn't function.  All over America there are administrators who are pissed that they were passed over.

          It's hard to estimate how many people McNasty has managed to insult.  But, that's how he's always gotten his way--by being the Bad Boy.

          How do you tell a predator from a protector? The predator will eat you sooner rather than later.

          by hannah on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:40:24 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Mayor vs. administrator (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            hannah

            I'd love to know exactly what she was responsible for as mayor. In the small suburban town where I grew up, we had a mayor and a chief administrator. The mayor showed up at graduation, Little League opening day, read proclamations, cut ribbons, etc. The chief administrator handled budgets, etc.

            From mayor to VP nominee in 20 months. Anyone else think Sarah Palin is power-hungry?

            "Kid, we don't like your kind, and we're gonna send your fingerprints off to Washington."--Alice's Restaurant

            by ekthesy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 06:14:13 AM PDT

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          •  I thought Palin was a part-time mayor (0+ / 0-)

            in Wasilla back in the 90's. $75,000 for a part-timer! In our city of 45,000 our part-time mayor in the 90's only got $15,000, now under a new charter, he's full-time but gets $60,000. Our city budget is almost $90,000,000 which doesn't include the schools or libraries.

        •  Yes, being a small-town mayor (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          GN1927

          IS a dream for some small-town hockey moms.  I can see why people like that actually believe it is the same as running a country.

          Someone like that should be dropped-off in downtown Manhattan and told to get their own cab.  

          Particularly someone who just got a passport.  I'm from the Chicago burbs, but still remember how intimidating downtown New York was the very first time.

          •  Must be different for everybody! (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            slinkerwink, Eman, marrael, paintitblue

            I left a small cows & corn town in OH for NYC in the late 80's, and was absolutely enthralled the first time I saw the Manhattan skyline.  Spent my first day walking all around & exploring the city---even parts I probably shouldn't have been exploring, heh.

            Didn't find anything intimidating.  I would honestly say I was more intimidated when we moved to the small town, in the first place, because of the homogenous appearance of the town and the people.  Being the only ethnic (Asian) family in the whole entire town might have had something to do w/ the feeling of intimidation, too.  In NYC, you immediately feel like you belong because everyone else is different just like you.  This was all before Guiliani ruined the unique character of the city.

            ...and I don't have a passport.  

            "a sign of a totalitarian state, of a dictatorship, when people did not question what their government did." Howard Zinn

            by dnn on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 06:01:14 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  This is why Obama/Biden don't hit on experience (0+ / 0-)

          but are focusing on how she hasn't said anything about jobs, mortgage crisis, health care, etc. They are trying to give her credit for winning those offices, and to seem respectful of her talents (without commenting what those talents really are ;-) ) but, I think, trying to use the same out-of-touch with what's on the minds of the majority of Americans right now argument they use against McCain.

      •  More like an affirmative action perversion. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        GN1927, LithiumCola

        Affirmative action aims to counteract crony hiring so the public gets the most qualified public servants.

        The Palin Person is not qualified for anything.  Town Administrators all over the country are pissed that they were passed over. LOL

        How do you tell a predator from a protector? The predator will eat you sooner rather than later.

        by hannah on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:36:46 AM PDT

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    •  Palin's "experience": health care in Alaska (13+ / 0-)

      Palin made no mention of health care during her entire speech.  She wants to be judged based on her experience, so let's look at it. According to the Kaiser health care system's website, statehealthfacts.org, 17% of Alaskans do not have health insurance.  9% of children do not health insurance. 20% of nonelderly women and 25% of nonelderly men are uninsured.  And 61% of the white nonelderly are uninsured.  The nonunsured population also includes 72% of families with at least 1 person employed full time.  

    •  Yes, but I think we need to redefine the (6+ / 0-)

      base as the exurbanites--the people who have been persuaded to seek the American dream in the boonies where they can golf and play at being recreational farmers.

      Whereas the earlier effort was on luring people out of the big cities to the burgeoning suburbs, more recently it's been Americas small cities that have been hollowed out.  And the people left behind probably think it's because all the money was used on urban development to benefit immigrant communities.  They have no idea that much of the money has simply disappeared into the pockets of land speculators and financiers and big box developments in the strip malls.

      How do you tell a predator from a protector? The predator will eat you sooner rather than later.

      by hannah on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:31:38 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  very good economic point (0+ / 0-)

        My idea of an agreeable person is a person who agrees with me. Benjamin Disraeli

        by pvmuse on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:37:59 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  The exurbanites are getting their asses kicked (0+ / 0-)

        High fuel prices is issue #1. Issue #2 is overdevelopment in exurban areas and a consequent poor housing market in those areas, driving down the price of housing and devaluing those who have already purchased.

        These exurbanites are typically Republican, but it remains to be seen whether they are actually true-believer social conservatives or voting-their-wallet fiscal conservatives.

        It would be nice to find some wedge to stick in there, because the two factions of the GOP have a very uneasy coexistence. After Bush, the fiscals are looking for a return to Reagan-era policies; this hard turn for the ticket towards the socials may be unsettling.

        "Kid, we don't like your kind, and we're gonna send your fingerprints off to Washington."--Alice's Restaurant

        by ekthesy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 06:18:14 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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