Skip to main content

View Diary: CNN: Reagan admin ignored Saddam gassing Kurds for trade (52 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  It's realpolitik (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jimstaro, C Barr

    Reagan ignored the event because he judged balancing Iran/Iraq as the more important issue.

    And let's step back a second. We have all (rightly) hammered Bush for going into Iraq and disrupting that balance. So what should Reagan have done? Invaded Iraq? Imposed crippling sanctions? I would bet more than a few people here opposed the sanctions that Clinton maintained on Iraq in the 90s.

    And look at it from another angle. Would anyone care to argue that the Iranians are better off today as a whole because of Carter's stance on human rights and not supporting the Shah?

    •  Dave (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      esquimaux, Scientician, C Barr, chrome327

      It goes back further than raygun, We, the CIA, had Saddam on the payroll and helped in putting him in power, as we also knew him to be the street thug he was!!

      "For all the GOP's patriotic imagery and testosterone-infused rhetoric,Results: Failed Policies Across the Spectrum

      by jimstaro on Mon Dec 01, 2008 at 12:35:50 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I am not arguing that (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        jimstaro, C Barr

        Nor am I saying that Reagan was a saint and could do no wrong. What I am saying is that Reagan's key concern was maintaining balance in the Middle East, which is also the concern of many Democrats today.

        The author is suggesting Reagan should have done something about the gassings. Fine, but it has to be noted that all the things he could have done are things we either hammer Bush on today (invasion) or were protested by Democrats in the past (sanctions).

    •  Of course! (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      jimstaro, ivorybill, dave3172, C Barr

      In answering your question,

      "Would anyone care to argue that the Iranians are better off today as a whole because of Carter's stance on human rights and not supporting the Shah?"

      I ask that these facts be considered:

      1. Their government is now local, not controlled through a puppet from a powerful country on the other side of the world.
      1. Being local, their government is much more easily subject to regime change from within the body politic, hopefully in a manner as peaceful as happened to the Soviet Union in the early 1990s, but by force if necessary when enough of the population is sufficiently fed up with the current regime.

      If it was able to happen in the USSR, it can happen in Iran as well. I advocate patience and political evangelism over direct military pressure from some country that the bulk of their population hates more than they hate their own regime.

      •  I appreciate that answer. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        jimstaro, C Barr, sjbob

        I also happen to agree with you on both points. I would argue, though, that until now, overall the Iranians are worse off. Especially women. You have the repression of the Shah's regime married to religious intolerance. Even with local control, overall they are still subject to a religious dictatorship that allows even fewer basic rights than the Shah did.

        I agree, though, that a majority of the people dislike their government and our job now has to be to encourage them through political and cultural contacts to work to overturn the current dictatorship.

        •  Women are far worse off in Saudi Arabia (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          jimstaro, sjbob

          And the rights of most Iranian women - rural and poor - were if anything worse under the Shah.  Maternal mortality has gone down and female enrollment in universities has gone up.  I'm not justifying the excesses of the Islamic Republic, but the Shah's reign was not a halcyon time for women unless you were a daughter of the upper class in Iran.

          "The red is going out. It's getting more bluer."

          by ivorybill on Mon Dec 01, 2008 at 01:35:59 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site