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  •  I hope you are snarking because as much as I (2+ / 0-)
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    ColoTim, Cofit

    despise Kristol he does have the right to say whatever the hell he wants in this country.

    A PBS mind in a Fox News World | -1.75/-4.00

    by Crookshanks on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 01:14:28 PM PST

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    •  Not as founding member of PNAC (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      erratic, synductive99

      in my opinion.

      •  I wasn't aware of a think-tank exception to the (2+ / 0-)
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        milkbone, Cofit

        1st amendment.  Could you point it out for me?

        A PBS mind in a Fox News World | -1.75/-4.00

        by Crookshanks on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 01:17:16 PM PST

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        •  Deliberately lying to the public (2+ / 0-)
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          erratic, synductive99

          as an insider to the master plan is a crime, not free speech.  

          •  I remember from my Comm Law class (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            erratic, BigAlinWashSt

            that there have been times in US history when speech has been censored when it is found to undermine a US military effort, I think when it has revealed classified information or used blatantly false information.

            Interestingly, I don't think anybody has ever had speech censored or been prosecuted for supporting the government's actions by exaggerating or lying about the reason's behind the government's actions.

            This is all hypothetical, but it is fascinating to think about from a legal perspective.

            Could a public figure be prosecuted for supporting the government if the government was found to not be telling the complete truth, whether purposely or not? I seriously doubt it.

            What I aim for: no personal insults, no snark

            by StanMO on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 01:47:36 PM PST

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      •  Even if he's the Grand Kleagle of the KKK (4+ / 0-)
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        Simplify, ColoTim, Crookshanks, Cofit

        he still has the right to say what he wants.

        If someone decides he can't speak anymore, then next week it might be your turn to not be allowed to speak.

        Hige sceal þe heardra, heorte þe cenre, mod sceal þe mare, þe ure mægen lytlað

        by milkbone on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 01:19:48 PM PST

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        •  it's not that simple (2+ / 0-)
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          BigAlinWashSt, polar bear

          For example, the President has no First Amendment right to go on TV and announce to the people of America that there are WMDs in Iraq.  Not when he knows that this is not true.

          My two-part plan for raising $700 billion. 1) Reinstate the inheritance tax. 2) Send Dick Cheney on a hunting trip with 700 billionaires.

          by RickD on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 10:02:46 PM PST

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    •  I always appreciate it when people are able to (3+ / 0-)
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      erratic, ColoTim, incognita

      stand up for those with whom they disagree. It displays the positive effect of a robust democratic society.

      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" - Voltaire (???)

      What I aim for: no personal insults, no snark

      by StanMO on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 01:52:25 PM PST

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    •  the First Amendment (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      BigAlinWashSt, polar bear

      does not grant an unfettered right to say anything at any time.

      For example, there is no First Amendment right to shout "fire" in a crowded theater.

      Threats are also not protected by the First Amendment, nor are incitements to crime nor "fighting words".

      That's really not the point here, though.  The government is legally bound to speak truthfully to the American public.  By deliberately lying, the government committed a high crime, and people like Kristol could certainly be indicted as co-conspirators.

      My two-part plan for raising $700 billion. 1) Reinstate the inheritance tax. 2) Send Dick Cheney on a hunting trip with 700 billionaires.

      by RickD on Tue Dec 02, 2008 at 10:01:18 PM PST

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    •  Agree and disagree (1+ / 0-)
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      Cofit

      I agree regarding protecting the First Amendment rights of people. I should, however, note that there are cases (and I am not sure if they should apply to the current US situation) where the media has been held accountable for atrocities it sparked. Rwanda is a more recent example. When does advocacy of violence (as we get from people like Bill O'Reilly and Ann Coulter) become responsible for violence carried out? Obviously the link has to be pretty direct, like in Rwanda. First Amendment rights should be protected until someone's speech directly sparks real violence against others.

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