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View Diary: MN-Sen Events v. 39.1, Desperate Norm Thread (190 comments)

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  •  Is Coleman Trying to Run Out the Clock? (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    buckhorn okie, Eloise, Cat Servant

    I'm likely full of mis-information, but isn't there some deadline Friday where the two camps and the canvassing board have to agree on how to count the wrongly rejected votes? Suppose no agreement is reached? Do these votes then get cast aside (Norm would love that!)? Once the Friday deadline passes (assuming there is a Friday deadline), can Franken go back to the MN Supreme Court and ask for a ruling that doesn't require agreement between Franken and Coleman (which is what the court should have done in the first place)?  

    I think Norm's ploy is to somehow run out the clock on the wrongly rejected absentees, then file a suit on the duplicates as his only chance of overtaking Franken's lead.

    •  yea but Norm will still lose (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Eloise

      we had a recount

      •  But, not a final recount -- not one w/o problems (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        zbob

        No one, including the Canvassing Board, believes the count they produced is a correct one. It glossed over the duplicate ballot issue. Plus, there are many ballots that were not challenged along these lines, that would be, when the floodgates open.

        Coming Soon -- to an Internet connection near you: Armisticeproject.org

        by FischFry on Wed Dec 31, 2008 at 08:42:24 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  Seeing that Norm is currently behind (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      zbob, Eloise, Toon

      ...I don't think that he wants them all thrown out. Running out the clock would make Franken the senator. No, Norm just wants to make sure that only the Republican votes are counted. Al, though currently ahead, simply wants all of the wrongly rejected ballots counted, whether or not they favor him. I guess that's why we call it the "Democratic" party.

      •  I Need to be More Clear (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        itskevin, TheShovelJockey

        By "run out the clock" I meant having the SoS certify Franken as the winner, THEN Coleman files an election contest suit with the court on the 150 duplicate ballots, hoping that somehow the court will issue a ruling that doesn't count the dupes.

        My feeling is that, if all the absentee votes get counted, the duplicate issue becomes moot as Franken will have an insurmountable lead.

        •  It's more complicated than that (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          zbob

          Once they open up the double-counting" can of worms, Franken's going to file his own challenges about double-counting and uncounted originals. The SoS, with the 2 campaigns' assent, set out somewhat arbitrary rules for counting duplicates or originals during the recount. Franken won't let Coleman cherry-pick 25 precincts where contests would produce over 100 Coleman votes. There are issues statewide.

          What Coleman is trying to achieve with the absentee ballots is one of 2 things -- either limit the damage or, hopefully, move things in the other direction. The real hope they might have is to wipe out the 50-vote lead by Monday, so the SoS could only certify Coleman. Since no one really knows what those absentee votes are, no one can know what the total would be, under either campaign's preferred ballot set -- but, they can dream....

          I had more to say about the election contest in my reply to your first comment.

          Coming Soon -- to an Internet connection near you: Armisticeproject.org

          by FischFry on Wed Dec 31, 2008 at 08:40:21 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  And if Coleman loses that (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            EricS, lenzy1000

            he'll file suit (he likes suits, no?) that they ought to count votes from New Orleans since Western Minnesota originally was part of the Louisiana Purchase.

            "you have the right to your own opinion. You do not have the right to your own facts" -Daniel Patrick Moynihan

            by SteveP on Wed Dec 31, 2008 at 08:58:46 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

    •  1 of 2 things would happen on Monday (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      CA Pol Junkie, zbob

      Either the Canvassing Board certifies the result, with the ballots they already have -- which would lead to election contest trials -- or the Bd. announces they can't do that, because there are all these uncounted ballots, in which case Franken would have to go to the Supremes and insist they do what they didn't even consider last time: announcing what the standards for counting the ballots will be.

      It would seem to me that Coleman's cherry-picking is calculated to produce a result that would have him in the lead -- their theory being that Franken doesn't object to those ballots being counted, so the Franken campaign cannot block them while they're fighting over the remainder. If they won this battle of wills, then Franken probably would be the one filing an election contest to challenge Monday's certification.

      The reality is that both sides will probably file election contests because both sides feel aggrieved by possible double-counting, or improper exclusion of uncounted originals. Coleman, once again, cherry-picked 25 precincts where he's arguing double-counting occurred. It appears, however, that this might not even be 10% of the total number of precincts with some problem along these lines. In fact, Franken argued to the Supreme Court that fairness (and the "dreaded equal protection" rule from the SCOTUS case that shall not be named) would require re-examining the ballots in all 4001 precincts.

      So, in addition to those challenges, one side or the other will be filing election contests that involve these wrongly rejected absentee ballots

      Coming Soon -- to an Internet connection near you: Armisticeproject.org

      by FischFry on Wed Dec 31, 2008 at 08:33:16 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  do you agree that the franken team is playing (0+ / 0-)

        a dangerous game by not blowing this thing up and risking a Coleman lead?

        After Obama's eighth straight victory, Penn told reporters: "Winning Democratic primaries is not a qualification or a sign of who can win the general election.

        by nevadadem on Wed Dec 31, 2008 at 08:44:21 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Nope. It will work to their advantage in the end (0+ / 0-)

          They're respecting the judgment of the local election judges -- in this review, anyway. That might be somewhat hypocritical given their earlier efforts to reverse the original rejections -- but, it will play well. They're also using that as a bit of a sword. Coleman wants to look at another 654 ballots that aren't being added by officials to the 5th pile. Franken's folks aren't agreeing to do that, even though there are some ballots (much smaller number) they'd like to add to the pile.

          Coming Soon -- to an Internet connection near you: Armisticeproject.org

          by FischFry on Wed Dec 31, 2008 at 10:35:41 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Thanks. (0+ / 0-)

        You're not related to Lutefisk, are you? :-)

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