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View Diary: Feminisms: "obsessed with having kids" (270 comments)

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  •  I never scream "racism" but there seems (10+ / 0-)

    to be a double standard with these cases. Generally, if the mother is white, the media celebrates the situation. If she isn't white the questions that you mention in this diary inevitably come up. They focus more on the moral and character defects of the mother. There is a double standard here.

    I wouldn't have eight children either in one sitting if I could avoid it. I understand why she chose to carry the pregnancy to term, but I also know that most of these stories often end tragically. In these multiple gestation pregnancies some of the babies die and some enter the world with severe birth defects. The nice stories like "John and Kate + 8" are the exception, not the rule.

    •  Because Christian Fundamentalism is Lilly White (8+ / 0-)

      And they're the ones who've been keeping the media's sponsors and owners in power till recently.

      It's not racism, Sonny.

      It's business.

      We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

      by Gooserock on Wed Feb 04, 2009 at 08:49:22 PM PST

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    •  Did we know she wasn't white until (6+ / 0-)

      recently?  These questions have brewing for 4 or 5 days.

      I will say though, that if you're from Ethipia and you have Octuplets, forget about making millions on the pictures of your babies...

      •  oh, not to worry.... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        crose

        ....starvation is going to become an equal-opportunity killer during this century.  Along with pandemics and resource wars.  

        For example Putin shuts off natural gas to various countries in Europe and people freeze to death: that's resource war.  Sooner or later one of them is going to fight back and ignite another general European war.  Over natural gas.

        •  Here (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          G2geek

          it will be water and what or who gets it. I can only hope I live to see the day when live-turf golf courses are outlawed and all of those "cement ponds" in Beverly Hills are filled in.  

          Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.

          by crose on Wed Feb 04, 2009 at 11:42:05 PM PST

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          •  i'm working on water issues right now. (0+ / 0-)

            Applying for a patent for something, and can't discuss it until the application is in.  

            But all the water conservation in the world won't make a difference if population keeps growing, so at some point we have to just call a halt to the insane mentality of growth.

            The way I put it these days is, "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.  The claim that you can get unlimited growth on the surface area of a Euclidean solid is as extraordinary as a claim for perpetual motion.  So where's your proof?"  

            In other words, throw it back in the growthists' faces: it's up to them to prove that growthism is possible, in the same way that it's up to someone who claims to have a perpetual motion machine to prove that it actually works.  

            •  And you know, when I made the (0+ / 0-)

              above comment, I was still thinking that the what, 35 golf courses in Las Vegas will someday not only be dead, they'll either be underneath some godawful subdivision or they'll have reverted back to desert.

              I don't understand why people can't see that we cannot grow anymore and must get the numbers down.

              Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.

              by crose on Sun Feb 08, 2009 at 12:01:17 AM PST

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    •  Previous octuplets.... (12+ / 0-)

      were born to a Nigerian American couple and got lots of help.

      This woman is being criticized for having seven in vitro pregnancies.  Seven.  Family begged her not to and she went ahead.  I don't think it is racism- I think it is folks realizing millions are being spent on this family because this woman undertook a high risk pregnancy- probably causing at least some children irreparable harm.  How many kids could have been getting medical care with the public funds spent on this woman and her high risk infants?  Her mom has said she sought counseling and wants to move out when Nadya returns home.  I think the mom sounds like the sane one.

      You shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you mad. Aldous Huxley

      by murrayewv on Wed Feb 04, 2009 at 08:53:35 PM PST

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    •  I have seen (11+ / 0-)

      people make comments like, "in their culture, they like to have big families, etc etc" but I don't think most people even realize that she's Middle Eastern, do they?

      Being of the exact same tribe as Angie Suleyman (Iraqi, of Christian origin), let me just say that her decisions are far more a product of her unbalanced mental state than of her cultural origins. I haven't really noticed any crazy media bias or racism--just people legitimately asking, wtf??? Seriously, she already had six kids, and she's a single mom and when she finds out she's pregnant with eight, she refuses to reduce the number??? That's not being Christian, that's being dumb. Those kids, by virtue of being preemies (and my brother has preemie multiples, so I know firsthand) are going to have problems (some minor, some major) and Angela is responsible for that. How on Earth could you continue a pregnance of 8 knowing that it was virtually certain you would be birthing children with serious problems?

      She's just nuts. Nothing to do with her culture or ethnicity, and I honestly don't think the media has been racist about it.

      •  One of her sons is autistic.... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        SnowCountry, crose, sortalikenathan

        How could you neglect the child you have for another newer model?

        You shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you mad. Aldous Huxley

        by murrayewv on Wed Feb 04, 2009 at 09:23:47 PM PST

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        •  absolutely (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          tryptamine, Sychotic1, murrayewv, G2geek

          But this is what gets me about the whole "life is sacred" babble that Christians are always talking about: they would rather give birth to children who will suffer in life and may be permanently disabled, to exercise some selfish ideology about the "sanctity" of life? So twisted and cruel. No matter that the quality of that life will be severely compromised.

          When my brother's wife had her triplets and they were in the neonatal unit, it was just about the most intense, sad, awful thing I'd ever seen. All those babies with all those problems. And even today my nieces have problems, one of them permanent.

          I fundamentally don't understand this woman's impulse to put her children's quality of life at risk to pursue her sick fantasy of having as many children as she can.

          •  it's like trying to understand drug addiction. (4+ / 0-)

            Why does this person get drunk / snort cocaine / shoot speed...?

            Why do they do it even though they know it's killing them?

            Any rational person would recognize that it's insane behavior.  But the person with the problem doesn't, and they keep doing it.  Even when the consequences are obvious.  

        •  That's the scary thing. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          murrayewv

          My brother's wife-person is from a family of ten kids. The parents made it clear from early on to those children that there were favorites. There are four black sheep as it were, and two of those are unbalanced people to whom nobody in the family speaks. I have always observed a broken doll-like quality to the relationships in that family--"oh, she's broken. We threw her out and made another one." It disgusts me. Have ONE. Treat her/him like the treasure he/she is.

          Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.

          by crose on Wed Feb 04, 2009 at 11:47:27 PM PST

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      •  the way i looked at the cultural issue was... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Sychotic1, crose, Tam in CA

        Someone said, "she's Iranian and they value large families."  My response was "So what?  I'm American and we value large cars.  Neither of which gives us the right to do things that kill the planet."

        It's better to discover that there is not a cultural rationale for what this woman did.  

        But even if there was, it doesn't matter, any more than culture makes a difference in the outcome of jumping off a bridge.  The laws of nature are color-blind, gender-neutral, and don't care about culture.  If we overpopulate and overconsume, we'll die off like yeast cells in a fermentation container.

    •  i could care less if someone is... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      samddobermann, drbloodaxe, crose

      ...white, black, tan, or purple with pink polka-dots.

      Reckless reproduction and conspicuous consumption are disgusting and are killing the planet.

      People who do either of those things are planet-killers which makes them worse than serial murderers.  

      •  You mean (0+ / 0-)

        Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.

        by crose on Wed Feb 04, 2009 at 11:57:40 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  no, that was the giant rotifer. (0+ / 0-)

          Rotifers look like that from the end, and are ordinarily microscopic organisms.  As far as I know they're not killing the planet.  The microscopic ones, that is.  But we should keep an eye on them anyway:-)

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