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View Diary: Creating Jobs Is Not "Wasteful" (259 comments)

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  •  While Merkley is a progressive (8+ / 0-)

    I'm not sure that energy is really going to be enough for the state of Oregon. We don't have the solar or wind capacity that states like Oklahoma, California, Texas and New Mexico do.

    We had a nearly statewide logging industry that got hit hard decades ago and never recovered. Where there wasn't logging, there was farming.

    Because of hydro, we don't have an energy crisis.

    That is all. Individually, I wish you the best, but collectively, my dearest hope is to outlive you - groovetronica

    by Nulwee on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 03:46:53 PM PST

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    •  You've got wind, which you can export (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      blueyedace2, rsmpdx, SciVo, FarWestGirl

      I used to live on the California coast, where some of the first wind farms were built in the Bay Area.  We need a new, high-tech HVDC electrical grid to allow long-distance export of electrical power, but I bet Oregon could sell a lot of wind-generated electricity to Seattle and California.

      Old-growth logging is not sustainable.  If you can't farm trees, you can harvest wind.

      Dear Republicans: You can't repeat a lie enough to make it true.

      by Dallasdoc on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 03:51:42 PM PST

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      •  There Is Wind (5+ / 0-)

        already developed in the eastern gorge.

        Oregon doesn't really have much old-growth to log. Merkley is talking about secondary growth, adamantly. I disagree that, other in most useful areas, the damage of 100 years of logging should be treated so that forests can return to the kind of shape they used to be in. However, being a place where timber grows faster (than dry forests in Wyoming and Colorado) our timber is a resource used around the world. It's inescapable.

        And there's not much you can do in the Willamette Valley (where the people are) and there's not much wind or much sun. I don't know about geothermal, but it's probably not on the kind of scale in the Rockies.

        In fact, less than 1% of the originall oak savannah in the Coast Mountain range remains... what's not used for farm/developed now has turned into forests... which never naturally occurred in first people's times. That can be logged, too.

        That is all. Individually, I wish you the best, but collectively, my dearest hope is to outlive you - groovetronica

        by Nulwee on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 03:59:39 PM PST

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    •  Actually, we do... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dallasdoc, FarWestGirl

      ..have an energy crisis. Most of our hydroelectric energy is exported out of state. Their are more solar/wind/geothermal opportunities in the eastern half of the state.
       The Dams on the Columbia are more suited for navigation than they are for power generation.

      Geese are but Geese tho' we may think 'em Swans; and Truth will be Truth tho' it sometimes prove mortifying and distasteful. Benjamin Franklin

      by winchelenator on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 06:03:37 PM PST

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      •  Uh (0+ / 0-)

        The Dams on the Columbia are more suited for navigation than they are for power generation.

        Unless I'm mistaken, my power comes from hydro.

        California and Washington have an energy crisis. The Portland metro (which is half the state) is extremely well situated by comparison.

        That is all. Individually, I wish you the best, but collectively, my dearest hope is to outlive you - groovetronica

        by Nulwee on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 06:55:22 PM PST

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      •  Dams on the Columbia river system (0+ / 0-)

        produce 80% of the electricity the West Coast uses.

        -5.38, -5.90 Deus mihi iustitiam dabit.

        by cjallen on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 08:54:48 PM PST

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    •  We have a huge capacity for energy production, (0+ / 0-)

      including wind.  But we don't need all of it, because the BPA provides plenty.  But California needs it.  They'll pay us for it.

      -5.38, -5.90 Deus mihi iustitiam dabit.

      by cjallen on Thu Feb 05, 2009 at 08:25:41 PM PST

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    •  Omigawd. You Can't Be Serious (0+ / 0-)

      I'm not sure that energy is really going to be enough for the state of Oregon. We don't have the solar or wind capacity that states like Oklahoma, California, Texas and New Mexico do.

      Development of modern wind turbines was largely initiated in the Columbia River Gorge.  There are few places on earth better suited for gathering energy from the wind.  

      A cloudy day in Eastern Oregon is rarer than a sign of intelligence from a winger.  

      Geothermal development is proceeding over the powerful opposition of environmental nitwits that once banned all geothermal development on BLM lands in Oregon and chased Chevron to foreign shores.  Few states have more bounteous resources though none are developed because of bureaucratic malfeasance.

      It is no accident whatever that the Oregon coast has been a prime site for testing wave power buoys.  Lockheed may well select the Oregon coast for the first commercial wave farm now being planned.

      But I was stunned to read Sen. Merkley's cogent observations on the need to manage forests properly.  

      While waiting on development of the EATR (Energetic Tactical Robot:

       title=

      a small army of actual humans could provide feedstock for biomass power plants as well as preventing forest fires.

      Surely you were joshing.

      Best,  Terry

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