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View Diary: Two Random Responses On The Subject Of Illegal Immigration (44 comments)

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  •  Are you lusting after one of those $10 per hour (0+ / 0-)

    housekeeping jobs represented by SEIU? If they have illegals in the union, it is precisely because the wages do not attract citizens. You cannot support yourself on $10 per hour in this country in a dignified manner. Those are poverty wages. Get your little calculator out and figure it out. Make yourself a budget for your $10 per hour salary and then visualize what your life would be like. How will you get ahead? You'll need to better yourself with an education. How will that work for your new budget?

    Farm labor is and always has been a completely different can of worms. But there, also, it is primarily wages. Any job, any job, will have workers clamoring for it if they can make a living by performing that job. Period.

    •  At Which Point You Have EXACTLY Two Choices (0+ / 0-)

      If they have illegals in the union, it is precisely because the wages do not attract citizens.

      1.) Clamp down on illegal immigration

      -- or --

      2.) Institute wage and price controls across all job sectors.

      Why do you think those jobs pay $10 per hour?

      Are you seriously suggesting that employers lowered wages and then the illegal immigrants showed up to take the jobs? No. The illegal immigrants showed up and then the wages dropped.

      Look at construction wages in California as an example. Home construction in CA used to be a high paying highly unionized job sector. It is now estimated that approximately 50% of all construction workers in CA are illegal immigrants and union membership in the construction trades has been decimated.

      Why is this the case?

      <div style="font-size:10px;text-align:center;background-color:#ffd;color:#f33">If the terriers and bariffs are torn down, this economy will grow - G. Bush

      by superscalar on Tue Feb 17, 2009 at 06:43:44 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I've watched the construction trades go downhill (0+ / 0-)

        over the past 30 years. I've watched very carefully. 40 some years ago, I envied the folks who had those jobs. But during the Reagan revolution, after it became fashionable and legal to declare war on the unions, the "independent contractor" was born. This was great for general contractors. They no longer had to employ their employees! And what happened to the employees when they were pitted against each other to bid on piece-work jobs? They had to undercut each other to stay employed. And yes, eventually, the illegals came in and undercut the citizens. Citizens knew how much they needed to make a living and support their families. The illegals knew what they needed to live 12 to a house and still have something left over to send home. Guess who got the contract.

        It was the busting of the unions that lead to this. Unions give people bargaining power and the workers stand united for decent wages and safe working conditions. Pitting worker against worker drives wages down.

        I've lived this history. I didn't just read it somewhere. I've witnessed it first hand. It's not just a California problem. It is country wide.

        •  Not When There Is Someone Waiting In Line (0+ / 0-)

          Unions give people bargaining power and the workers stand united for decent wages and safe working conditions

          To take the job. If this were not true there would be no $10 per hour jobs in the SEIU.

          <div style="font-size:10px;text-align:center;background-color:#ffd;color:#f33">If the terriers and bariffs are torn down, this economy will grow - G. Bush

          by superscalar on Tue Feb 17, 2009 at 07:06:02 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  You are completely ignorant about how the busting (0+ / 0-)

            of unions has contributed to this race to the bottom for wages. So I will end trying to talk rationally with you about that.

            For the record, I agree with you that employers need to be held accountable for hiring illegals. If unions are admitting illegals as members, they should also be held accountable.

            Also - "the borders" includes all ports of entry as well as lines drawn in the sand. Proper staffing of INS and border patrol will go a long way to stem the tide.

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