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View Diary: Why the "morals vote" didn't cost us the election. (281 comments)

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  •  I think we'll lose (none)
    and play into their hands if we try to "out religion" the right.

    There is a Civic Faith that we all share, which includes the writings of religious leaders. Common Sense, Declaration of Independence, Constitution, Gettysburgh Address, Letter from a Birmingham Jail ...

    Lets remind each other of the shared faith we all say we share.

    ""All things entail rising and falling timing. You must be able to discern this." - Miyamoto Musashi

    by Madman in the marketplace on Fri Nov 05, 2004 at 12:09:12 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Letter from a Birmingham Jail (none)
      I think the ultimate reality is we have to make changes, but we don't want to take a step towards religious conservatism, because there are key constituencies who disagree with that.

      But we don't want to go leftwards, either: we performed well in the democratic counties, and got killed in the others. We lost Ohio and Florida -- the king makers -- by a nose. We do not want to alienate moderate and conservative democrats.

      The key is message.

      A lot of people are liberal, and they just don't know it. And for one specific subcategory, this includes religious liberals -- there are more of them than you think.

      And Letter from a Birmingham Jail is a perfect example -- it's a powerful document that appeals to Christians and secularists alike, even with its abundance of Christian imagery. It's this kind of discourse that needs to be resurrected and moved back into the mainstream.

      •  depends (none)
        on what you mean by "leftward." I don't think we went leftward enough.

        Employment, social justice, civil rights ... those are leftist values, Instead, we ran away from them.

        "Letter from a Birmingham Jail" is one of the essential documents in the sacrements of our civic faith. that faith is based around something we all agree on: government is constituted on the consent of the governed.

        ""All things entail rising and falling timing. You must be able to discern this." - Miyamoto Musashi

        by Madman in the marketplace on Fri Nov 05, 2004 at 02:47:03 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Is going more leftward really the answer? (none)
          I don't think we would have won Ohio or Florida should John Kerry had taken a stronger stance on any of those values.

          He talked about outsourcing, about the patriot act, extending health care to the americans who've lost it, even goals for energy independence that didn't involve trying to find new supplies of oil.

          I'm not sure he would have impressed people with "a home for every homeless person", or "a job for every jobless person" -- even if those are values that I embrace, I bet he'd have lost Wisconsin and maybe even Michigan if he tried to press those too hard.

          The platform was more or less right. The problem was the voters, and the problem was the message. And the republicans leveraged wedge issues, and undermined Kerry's message (but not his platform).

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