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View Diary: Urgent appeal - Gay men escaping Iraq (150 comments)

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  •  I guess I'm wondering why the position of the (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Larry Bailey, ms badger, kyril, Alec82

    U.S. military cannot be changed.  I understand what you are saying and have done a little bit of research on this myself.  I definitely understand (and this is another crime) this:

    The US army has virtually no cultural knowledge of Iraq and would not be able to find these men, let alone help them.  

    It would have seemed like a prerequisite of any invasion to have such cultural knowledge in advance, let alone more than 5 years after an invasion.  But there is so much wrong here that this huge exclamation point amounts to a digression.

    When you ask how the U.S. military could help these men, I suppose my position is that a first step might be to stop resisting helping them.  This whole oppressive vignette (which you lay out very well, by the way) smacks of deeply imperialist reasoning .. but when the mission changed from invasion to occupation one natural conclusion of that might have been to establish links with trustworthy organizations like Helem, et. al. and to focus on gaining the "cultural knowledge" that had heretofore been lacking.

    I very much respect your point of view, by the way, and I thank you for the diary.  I understand there are many practical problems I might not fully understand.  Thank you again, it's an education.

    Because my life doesn't need to be an educational experience for someone else. (-6.62, -6.26)

    by AndyS In Colorado on Sun Apr 12, 2009 at 10:27:18 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Kind of makes you wonder, Andy... (4+ / 0-)

      ...what our military would be doing about this if we didn't have the stupid DADT policy and if gay people were valued as an integral part of our services. Might make us set up a safe house/refuge for these persecuted men and get them out of that hellhole.

      39 Years Of Yellow-Dogging And Then 1 Year Of WTF

      by Larry Bailey on Sun Apr 12, 2009 at 10:33:14 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I didn't want to bring that up in this context, (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Larry Bailey, alizard, ms badger, kyril, Alec82

        but, yeah.

        I mean we created or at least exacerbated the "hellhole" in the first place with an inadequate understanding of the cultures of the Middle East.  When they see the hypocrisy of our own stances on things, it helps them to see us as decadent and incoherent.

        We may lose the entire Middle East for a generation because we have had a stance of lecturing them from a position of moral superiority instead of first looking to ourselves and cleaning up our own messes before lecturing anyone, or at least as a prerequisite to the idea of lecturing anyone.

        As a country, we have to learn to speak to others in their own language.  The Republicans' reliance on the hammer in international affairs as opposed to the tweezers, in my view, is at the root of much of this.

        Because my life doesn't need to be an educational experience for someone else. (-6.62, -6.26)

        by AndyS In Colorado on Sun Apr 12, 2009 at 10:45:17 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  a generation? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          AndyS In Colorado

          In a generation, the Middle East will be out of the oil business. Unless they develop replacement cash flows, there won't be a US military or for that matter, a US commercial presence in that part of the world.

          At that point, they effectively drop off the world map.

          Looking for intelligent energy policy alternatives? Try here.

          by alizard on Sun Apr 12, 2009 at 05:33:09 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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