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View Diary: Mother of U.S. Marine Who Was Waterboarded Rips Cheney, Others (235 comments)

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  •  I think the intention is fundamentally misguided. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    kurt

    The torture aspect of SERE training simply makes one more likely to suffer from PTSD, and more likely to have an adverse reaction to severe stress.  The notion of resistance to "breaking" is a fallacy.  You have to remember the origins of the program - the US was concerned about "brain washing" and false confessions during the anti-commie frenzy of the 1950s.  That part of SERE is a relic.

    •  Everybody breaks under torture (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kurt, VTCC73

      SERE Resistance training teaches what the techniques are so that pilots can survive the ordeal -- not to "resist" in order to not "break" under torture and not divulge secrets.  Everybody breaks under torture -- SERE is to help them learn how to stay alive long enough to get home.

      It's better for the pilot to find out early if the training itself is too much to handle psychologically, since that is far preferable to finding it out after they've already been captured.

      Please read any of the excellent essays from Jeffersonian Democrat, a graduate of the SERE program who has diaried about his experiences here!

      •  Read what a SERE psychologist said (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        kurt

        here.

        I agree about the purpose to fallout from the program, but even SERE psychologists question the value of waterboarding.  Ogrisseg isn't the first to raise this issue, and has good statistics to back up his concerns.

        •  I agree with you (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          kurt

          You said: "The notion of resistance to "breaking" is a fallacy."  That is true.

          Ogrisseg questioned the efficacy of waterboarding as part of training because "the waterboard produced capitulation and compliance with instructor demands 100% of the time."  Which is exactly what I said -- everybody breaks under torture.

          That's not the point of that exercise -- it's to prepare the pilots for the worst possible things that could be done to them, not to teach them 'not to break'.  Of course there is a danger of increased susceptibility to  PTSD -- this is extremely serious training intended to help our people survive f***ing torture.

          The risk of PTSD is very real, but as Ogrisseg's own stats show, the actual incidence is thankfully low.  Luckily, the student receives immediate medical and psychiatric care, which would not happen if they are tortured as a POW.  

          It's a reasonable question to ask whether the risk of PTSD from the training is worse than the PTSD from being tortured as a POW without this preparation and training.

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