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View Diary: What I Wish All Straight People Knew (96 comments)

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  •  We agree to differ then. I like putting (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sberel

    equal rights for humans before the right to have freedom of speech.

    Hate speech can never, imho, be more important than the right of human equality.

    "The care of human life and happiness and not their destruction is the first and only legitimate object of every good Government" ~ Thomas Jefferson

    by watershed on Sat Jun 13, 2009 at 01:32:21 PM PDT

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    •  Who gets to define "Hate speech" (0+ / 0-)

      That's what worries me.

      I cannot think of a practical definition that I want to live with.

      I think that there are a lot of things on Dkos that would count as hate speech directed at:
      Republicans
      Radio Commentators
      Christian fundamentalists
      Governors of Northern Oil Rich States
      etc.

      I would not like a govt entity looking over our shoulder to see if we are saying things that are "hateful."

      But, I do not hope to convince you.  We can certainly disagree amiably.

      Numbers are like people . . . Torture them enough and they'll tell you anything.

      by Actuary4Change on Sat Jun 13, 2009 at 07:21:50 PM PDT

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      •  I agree that there are a lot of hateful (0+ / 0-)

        things being said on Kos against the list you mention.  That is part of what sometimes bothers me about this place, because hate breeds hate, and pushes people further apart.  The radio-commentator saying racist things causes retaliation here, and what is said here, causes the O'Reilly's to retaliate again, and so it becomes an ugly downward spiral...

        But that is not to say the govt should intervene in these cases.  How it is defined in our constitution in fairly simple: Any public statement that incites violence against someone on the grounds of their race, sexual orientation, age, disability, etc is considered not acceptable, and the person making these statements can be fined.

        Removing the hatespeech from the media (radio, TV, newspapers) on this basis has gone a long way to aid reconciliation in South Africa.

        ~smiles.  I also do not hope to convince you.  Just to maybe offer a different perspective on the 'first amendment before any other rights' perspective.  There are other rights that are, imho, more important than the right to freedom of speech at all costs, especially when those costs include the cost of human lives.

        I'd rather be alive, and watch my tongue on the radio, than be able to say what I want and be dead because somene did not like what I said and incited others to come and kill me.

        Have a peaceful Sunday

        ;-)

        "The care of human life and happiness and not their destruction is the first and only legitimate object of every good Government" ~ Thomas Jefferson

        by watershed on Sun Jun 14, 2009 at 02:05:05 AM PDT

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        •  I do appreciate the dialogue (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          watershed

          And I am interested to know that your perspective is South African.  I had been assuming European for no good reason.

          It will be interesting to see how the key ambiguities in your constitution are interpreted over time.

          I am referring to "incites violence" and "etc."

          An excessively broad reading of these would lead to severe restrictions on speech.  A very narrow reading could result in essentially the current American position.

          It sounds like you are somewhere in between too.

          I will have a peaceful Sunday, and I wish the same to you (Though this is too late given the time difference).

          Numbers are like people . . . Torture them enough and they'll tell you anything.

          by Actuary4Change on Sun Jun 14, 2009 at 08:30:31 AM PDT

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