Skip to main content

View Diary: The Shoah by Bullets (99 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  A Very Interesting Diary (11+ / 0-)

    I never thought of the Shoah as a product of the Enlightenment or modernism.  On one hand it seemed part of a romantic, nationalist reaction to the Enlightenment -- German nationalism rising in counterpoint to Napolean's occupation of Germany.  On the other, it harkened back to a pre-reason tribal lizard brain.  Something probably even older than King David's collection of 10,000 foreskins.

    According to Walter Laqueur, it was the influence of the Enlightenment -- the notion that all people were reasonable creature -- that began the integration of Jews into European universities and the civil service.

    The Shoah always seemed to me to be part of all that weird pseudo-mystical volkitcher Wagner crap.

    This aggression will not stand, man.

    by kaleidescope on Sun Aug 23, 2009 at 09:33:28 PM PDT

    •  I Mean (6+ / 0-)

      Nazism always seemed the antithesis Enlightenment thinking, such as:

      All men are created equal
      They are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights
      That among these are the rights to
      Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.

      Or something like that.

      This aggression will not stand, man.

      by kaleidescope on Sun Aug 23, 2009 at 09:55:43 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Part of the problem with the scholarship to date (10+ / 0-)

      ...is that the Shoah is used as a means to hang whatever theory of human nature the author wishes to ascribe.  With such a large event, encompassing so many different individuals and actions, there is always some detail which can be used to justify one's point.

      The urge to save humanity is almost always a false face for the urge to rule it. ~ H.L. Mencken

      by Jay Elias on Sun Aug 23, 2009 at 10:19:40 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  You want to be careful with that Blank Slate. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        IreGyre

        I find nothing unusual about the Shoah. That sort of behavior occurs all through the Old Testament. G-d seems somewhat racist in that history, and certainly vengeful. Amalekites, anyone?

        I'm sure your scholarship is up to the task of understanding that cultures find it difficult to exist in parallel, and assimilation is an intelligent and survivalist tactic when so confronted.

        Without obsessive record keeping about ethnic and religious origins, the job of those trying to purify the race/culture/religion would be almost impossible.

        I'm surprised at how the human/animal tendency to breed like with like, and eject the different is downplayed when this sort of history is told.

        Black pebbles on the white beach, nails that stick up, etc. Works on many scales. Something's missing here, I sense.

        •  I'm not sure I understand what you mean... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Youffraita, yaque

          ...and I certainly didn't state anything about a blank slate.

          While the Old Testament is, of course, not history at all, certainly there have been many mass exterminations of humans by other humans throughout much of history.  But whether or not the Shoah itself is unusual, the reaction of humanity to the Shoah is.  The word "genocide" didn't even exist until the Shoah; it was coined in reaction to it.  The place the Shoah occupies in the human psyche is unusual, even if the events are not.

          The urge to save humanity is almost always a false face for the urge to rule it. ~ H.L. Mencken

          by Jay Elias on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 12:13:53 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

  • Recommended (121)
  • Community (57)
  • Memorial Day (29)
  • Culture (21)
  • Environment (20)
  • Rescued (19)
  • Law (19)
  • Civil Rights (19)
  • Science (18)
  • Marriage Equality (16)
  • Labor (16)
  • Media (15)
  • Elections (15)
  • Education (15)
  • Ireland (14)
  • Trans-Pacific Partnership (14)
  • Economy (14)
  • Republicans (13)
  • Josh Duggar (13)
  • Racism (11)
  • Click here for the mobile view of the site