Skip to main content

View Diary: Senate Pitfalls on HCR: Do all Roads Lead to Reconciliation? (132 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  so the CEO is the only employee getting paid? (0+ / 0-)

    Sorry, but I know how it works and if Medicare is running with 2-3% overhead and private health care is running at 20-30% overhead, private health care is not being run well or is lining the pockets of a few people very well.  Either way try reducing wellpoints revenues down 18-27% and see what that does to costs for regular people.

    •  Is it your contention that government workers (0+ / 0-)

      don't get paid?

      And you have yet to support your figures, where I have at least provided support for the contention that overhead is substantially less than you claim.

      OTOH, if you were to pay attention, you would find that Medicare costs aren't exactly under control, in spite of squeezing per-procedure payments to a point that some doctors won't see Medicare patients.

      Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

      by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 11:42:45 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  not even the US President makes $10 million (0+ / 0-)

        and he does not get stock options and a golden parashut and all the other unnecessary payments executives at private health care companies get.  And I guess you are proposing that you just die quick if you cannot afford health care.  Medicare is effective and a successful program even according to doctors.

        •  Medicare cost per patient varies widely, but (0+ / 0-)

          yes, it is good for doctors who make themselves rich by gaming the system, not so hot for doctors who don't.

          Do a little looking around and you'll find a New Yorker article that is pretty famous at DK. It makes the case that we need actual health care reform, not just new insurance options.

          Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

          by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 12:12:09 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  a public option is the heart of the reform (0+ / 0-)

            without providing an option the insurance companies cannot game things will not change.  Medicare shows what happens when the market cannot take care of itself.  A strong public option is the next step.

            •  You are welcome to believe that, but (0+ / 0-)

              payment is only the outer layer of the onion. Real cost reduction requires cutting the onion to its heart.

              Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

              by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 12:33:09 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  breaking the current monopoly (0+ / 0-)

                that is what a strong public option does.

                •  It doesn't break any monopolies but that at the (0+ / 0-)

                  very outer layer.  It doesn't reach down to where the costs are.

                  Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                  by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 01:22:25 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  it breaks it (0+ / 0-)

                    it effectively provides another mechanism for getting health care.  Not all people will be eligible, but the impact will be great.

                    •  Ummm... (0+ / 0-)

                      It's still the same doctors, hospitals, clinics, pharmacies, pharmaceuticals, etc that we have now.

                      The impact will be great on those who can get insurance that they couldn't get before, a little less great on those who already couldn't afford the insurance they were getting.  

                      Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                      by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 02:22:54 PM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  you are focusing on the details (0+ / 0-)

                        but the big win is in private health care not having a monopoly.  If they continue to do a bad job then Medicare and other programs will continue to be expanded.  Unrealistic overhead and big salaries at the private health care will no longer be substantial.

                        •  The details have a lot to do with whether or not (0+ / 0-)

                          there is a win.  If we have a bill, but I can't find work (like now) and I can't afford insurance (the average family can't) it won't feel like a win at all.

                          I have to live with the details long after the high-fives and euphoria fade away.

                          Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                          by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 02:42:07 PM PST

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  so health care reform would help you (0+ / 0-)

                            if it has a strong public option.  You would be able to get health care without having to get it through a job and at a reasonable price.

                          •  Bumper stickers provide no comfort. (0+ / 0-)

                            Nobody has made a credible case for how a public option is going to help me - certainly no public option that is likely to get passed.

                            That being the case, I get the feeling I am far more likely to be hurt by health care reform than helped.

                            Looks like a bunch rich folks wanted health care on their resumes, but didn't want to do the heavy lifting to make something that might actually help we who struggle along in the poor dumb masses.

                            Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                            by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 04:05:21 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  if you are un-insured and not employed (0+ / 0-)

                            you will be eligible to apply for the public option government health care insurance.  How is that not helping?

                          •  Depends. (0+ / 0-)

                            First, I am not uninsured.  My wife is still employed and we pay 25% of what she makes on her employer-provided insurance.

                            That's likely to become worse under the new bill.  Possibly much worse, if the cost of employing people is increased sufficiently.  In that case, we'll certainly qualify for the public option as we'll both be out of work.  I would not call that a win.

                            Those things, however, are why the details matter.

                            Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                            by dinotrac on Thu Nov 12, 2009 at 06:24:56 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  if you want things to be bad they will. (0+ / 0-)

                            You actually seem to be struggling to find the worst possible scenario to come up with.  It will not be more expensive for employers to insure health coverage, don't know how you arrived at that.  In fact you will have more options either way with health care reform that has a strong public option.

                          •  No. Things will be bad if they are bad. (0+ / 0-)

                            If you don't care about reality, that is your right.
                            I will celebrate if things are better, but that has yet to be established.

                            Given that all the action so far is about extending coverage and forcing people to get it, with no action on cost reduction, I am justified in my skepticsim.

                            Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                            by dinotrac on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:57:05 AM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  we agree to disagree, read the bill n/t (0+ / 0-)
                          •  Trying to avoid it -- it's soooooo long!!! nt (0+ / 0-)

                            Free speech? Yeah, I've heard of that. Have you?

                            by dinotrac on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 03:19:45 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site