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View Diary: CafePress out Hoffmans Hoffman - Reversing Reversal on Psalm 109:8 (304 comments)

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  •  I used to to be against these sorts of (16+ / 0-)

    things, it seemed like we are picking nits while ignoring the big issues.  The problem is that even if you don't want to be part of the right's game, you are in it.  With each incremental step they push the bounds further and further, making what was obscene yesterday tolerable today.  They declared a war on culture and because they did not meet any resistence, their framing prevailed.  Part of cleaning up the mess we are in is taking back our language and our boundaries.  

    If they want to make up slogans that disrespect the president, they can, our side did not refrain from doing that to Bush.  However, what was unacceptable then is still unacceptable now, you do not call for the death of the president, ever.  It was clear that the meaning was a call to violence, although not a direct call.  It was never acceptable to call for the death of President Bush and given that the current climate of fear adds fuel to the calls for violence, we need to make it clear that it is unacceptable to promote the idea of assassination.

    •  Sounds like you followed pretty much the (7+ / 0-)

      same path as me in figuring out ignoring the nasties is simply not an option.  While it usually shuts people up, with them, it just made them worse.

      "If you trust you are not critical; if you are critical you do not trust" by our own Dauphin

      by gustynpip on Fri Nov 20, 2009 at 11:43:41 AM PST

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    •  With all due respect, I disagree (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      pgm 01

      that "[i]t was clear that the meaning was a call to violence, although not a direct call." There's a meaningful difference between calling for someone's death and wishing for it, which is why I refused to get my undies in a bunch about Cafe Press's flip-flopping on this. IMHO far too much credit is given to fundamentalist interpretations of the Old Testament - by both sides. I find that almost as scary as the implied violence behind the psalm itself. I'm not saying there aren't enough crazies out there that the possibility for real violence doesn't exist. But some of the hyperventilating on this site about this use of the psalm looked kind of crazy.

      Like I said in my original comment, it's just an f'n book, literature, fiction, poetry, etc.

      •  If the merchandise (8+ / 0-)

        had simply said Psalm 109:8, that could have been construed as 'wishing for'.

        But when you use the command form: "Pray for Obama", and that prayer is seeking someone's wife become a widow (the following verse), you are beyond wishing and right into working toward.

        Important to remember, that these evangelical sorts think they can influence events through mass prayer.

        The result would not be 'some crazy killed the POTUS', the result would be 'God answered our prayer in the person of xyz assassin.'

        You can't just read this stuff through the eyes of someone reasonable and logical.  You have to read it through fairy dust lenses.

        We"supported him not to revive a right-left war, but to...move past that divide. He has kept that promise. We need to reward him with our support." Sullivan

        by pvlb on Fri Nov 20, 2009 at 01:02:34 PM PST

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