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View Diary: The Swiss Vote against Religious Freedom (257 comments)

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  •  Yeah maybe you shouldn't use words like (2+ / 0-)
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    AaronInSanDiego, valion

    "ethnic' quite so loosely next time. And I would like to see some evidence that there is really some inherently 'Swiss' culture apart from its national components. Certainly there is a shared understanding of the importance of democracy but even there there have been some cantonal variation.

    Many, perhaps most major European nations made determined attempts to create national identities in the 18th and 19th century mostly without success, Bavaria doesn't see itself as identical to Prussia, or Brittany to France, or Catalonia to Spain, or Sicily to Italy, or for that matter Scotland to England, variations in culture, language, and yes ethnicity persist to this day. And historically Pan-Hellenism and Pan-Slavism were not exactly total successes, you can ask the people of Yugo (lit South) Slavia how that worked out. Or the Soviet Union.

    And Jay you have not exactly been a model of civility here yourself. Perhaps you should take your own advice, say "Ugh" and "I'm bored" and get some sleep.
    I have not spent a huge amount of time at dKos in recent years having followed the famous advice of Yogi Berra: "Nobody goes there any more, it is too crowded". But really the only reason I have a three digit number is because I slept in the Sunday they introduced Scoop registration, if I had gotten up when I usually did I would be tucked in at most just a couple of dozen slots behind Meteor Blades.

    •  Perhaps I shouldn't (3+ / 0-)
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      capelza, unspeakable, Mariken

      That said, the Swiss federation dates back to the late 13th century.  While Switzerland is certainly an amalgam of German, French and Italian cultures as well as Rhaeto-Romanic culture, the interaction of these cultures has led to a shared cultural identity where the varying aspects have interplay and overflow.  A good comparison could be the various regional cultures of the US; while there are deeply distinct cultures of, for example, New England and the American south, there is shared cultural awareness.  Neither are identical, of course, no more than Bavaria and Prussia are.  But Bavarians and Prussians both consider themselves German.

      To be sure, I am not the model of civility.  It is a failure on my part, and I do apologize to you.  And to all.  That said, all my initial statement attempted to demonstrate is that the Swiss and Muslims are not equivalent groups, a point that I consider self-evident.  Cheers.

      The urge to save humanity is almost always a false face for the urge to rule it. ~ H.L. Mencken

      by Jay Elias on Sun Nov 29, 2009 at 11:36:20 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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