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View Diary: ALL Hands On Deck: CALL Congress Today On Health Bill! (280 comments)

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  •  that's why there is the amendment process (0+ / 0-)

    "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." --M. L. King "You can't fix stupid" --Ron White

    by zenbassoon on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 09:28:30 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  two words (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      slinkerwink, JRandomPoster

      joe lieberman.

      for whatever reason, the democratic "party" has seen fit to allow him veto power.

      amend the bill all you want - lieberman will veto.

      WARNING: THIS COMMENT MAY OR MAY NOT CONTAIN SARCASM.

      by the disinfector on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 09:30:35 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  That's true. He now has disproportionate power (5+ / 0-)

        and Obama thanked him for it.

        I work full-time with the FDL team on health reform thanks to your donations.

        by slinkerwink on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 09:32:03 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  two more words: corporate dollars (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Cedwyn, elwior, the disinfector

        The inadequate is the enemy of the necessary.

        by JRandomPoster on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 09:34:20 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Actually, there are about 80 more words (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Cedwyn

        They are all names of Republican Senators who are the ones really to blame.

        I'm mad at Joe, but let's face facts - Joe isn't a Democrat.

        "It is a serious thing to live in a society of possible gods and goddesses." - CS Lewis, Weight of Glory

        by Benintn on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 09:38:18 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  And the Blue Dogs and other Baucus's. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          elwior, kevin k, CMYK

          But mostly, it's about the corporate dollars, the greed, ego and avarice of the politicians and of their corporate masters.

          The inadequate is the enemy of the necessary.

          by JRandomPoster on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 09:41:59 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  which is why obama's complicity perplexes me (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            elwior, JRandomPoster, kevin k

            for me, the single biggest advantage he offered as a candidate was that he wasn't bankrolled by huge corporations.  since he got so much money from small donors, ordinary citizens, i thought there was good reason to believe that we were the ones he'd be loyal to.

            our money's no good in DC, i guess.

            and for a guy who talked so much about hope, i can't really think of a better way to crush it completely than to get a bunch of people emotionally invested and then crush their spirits completely.

            if i were a little more cynical, i'd think he did that on purpose.

            WARNING: THIS COMMENT MAY OR MAY NOT CONTAIN SARCASM.

            by the disinfector on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 10:04:01 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  One possible answer... (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              elwior

              ... may be that he is indeed a good man, who really does want the change that we are looking for.

              He finds himself up against far more corporate muscle money and power then even a "jaded Chicago politician" ever thought he'd be up again, with even more control over too many legislators than he'd thought could exist.

              He finds that the Washington momentum after the Bush years is juggernaut like: folks have their personal gravy trains, their programs, their little power networks that they don't want to see diminished or dismantled.

              So he does the best he can to at least try to change some of this momentum, to actually try to make things better.  In this scenario, he's selling his integrity for us, not for personal gain.  He figures that if he goes all out, if he champions for what he championed for on the campaign, that nothing at all will be accomplished, and that even a smidgen of improvement is better than nothing.

              But even this analysis has him failing on two fronts:  one, leadership.  If you don't risk loosing, you can't win very much.  And two, judgment.  He thought that he could work within the system and continually compromise, continually empower those who he knew were enemies in an attempt to get something, anything, passed.  And this also failed.

              The inadequate is the enemy of the necessary.

              by JRandomPoster on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 10:15:40 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  and a third - negotiation (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                aliasalias, elwior

                you don't get what you want by giving away 90% of your demands before you get to the table.

                you get what you want by asking for the moon as a starting position and fighting like hell to get every little scrap you can.

                i'm tired of hearing HCR described as a compromise.  we've gone from single payer to strong public option to weak public option to opt-out to triggers to limited medicare buy in to ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

                we've given up everything we wanted.  what have they given up?  in what universe is this compromise?

                WARNING: THIS COMMENT MAY OR MAY NOT CONTAIN SARCASM.

                by the disinfector on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 10:24:17 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

            •  Actually, he WAS bankrolled by major (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              neroden

              corporations in small donations from people in the health insurance industry and wall street industries.

              I work full-time with the FDL team on health reform thanks to your donations.

              by slinkerwink on Thu Dec 17, 2009 at 10:28:16 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

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