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View Diary: Health Care By The Numbers (340 comments)

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  •  You're confusing "benefit" with "subsidy." (0+ / 0-)

    They are not, in fact, the same. The subsidies are a joke because they still shackle the working poor and lower-middle-class with paying for mandated insurance policies that don't get them any closer to actual medical care. That's unethical and unrealistic.

    You're completely exaggerating the "worth" of these forced mandate insurance plans for those least likely to be able to afford it. Forcing people to cough up money they do not have, for insurance plans they cannot use because of high deductibles and out-of-pocket, isn't progressive or sustainable. It's corporate to the hilt.

    There are a lot of assumptions about those community health centers, but not much is known about the details. How do they solve the real-world problem of affordability for those without healthcare but who make too much to qualify for Medicaid? What about those who need chronic care beyond "primary"? Will these centers be used as pork for political bribes before they're even built?

    Party like it's 1929, baby.

    by CMYK on Tue Dec 29, 2009 at 01:26:52 PM PST

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    •  sorry (0+ / 0-)

      Although i am sympathetic, here's reality:

      They are not, in fact, the same. The subsidies are a joke because they still shackle the working poor and lower-middle-class with paying for mandated insurance policies that don't get them any closer to actual medical care. That's unethical and unrealistic.

      Since this is our actual system, subsidies are no joke. What this buys is access to the system. The benefits are no pre-existing conditions, increased community health center funding and elimination of lifetime caps. The subsidies make it practical.

      You're completely exaggerating the "worth" of these forced mandate insurance plans for those least likely to be able to afford it. Forcing people to cough up money they do not have, for insurance plans they cannot use because of high deductibles and out-of-pocket, isn't progressive or sustainable. It's corporate to the hilt.

      You are over-exaggerationg their worth(lessness) in order to make a point. For those who qualify (the most needy), Medicaid is actually worth plenty (and this expands that.) The other plans vary, some are better than others.

      There are a lot of assumptions about those community health centers, but not much is known about the details.

       That's complete bullshit. FQHC (Federally qualified health centers) exist now and do a world of good - I work with them every day.

      Don't believe everything you read on the internets. In the real world, these have value.

      They are not single payer. They do not reform all aspects of the med system. We are not done. But they have value.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by Greg Dworkin on Tue Dec 29, 2009 at 04:16:44 PM PST

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      •  Well, by now it should be pretty clear that (0+ / 0-)

        I don't believe everything I read online!

        Since I don't know how many ppl will be harmed by falling through the built-in cracks in these proposals, I hope I'm overestimating the fail. I don't think it's too far off, though, and it may end up being an underestimation. Beyond that, I'm going to guess that we inhabit different real worlds.

        For those who qualify (the most needy), Medicaid is actually worth plenty (and this expands that.)

        As I mentioned, I was specifically referencing the ppl who make too much to qualify for Medicaid but not enough to actually pay those forced mandates. For them, the subsidies are a joke, just as unaffordable as before, but now with  IRS penalties and no additional access to care.

        I think you'll be surprised at how many that ends up affecting. Perhaps we both will.

        Party like it's 1929, baby.

        by CMYK on Tue Dec 29, 2009 at 08:42:24 PM PST

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