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View Diary: What Democratic leadership failure looks like (337 comments)

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  •  Yes, and worse. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    maxschell, MindRayge, Uberbah

    So, let's take a look at some of your points.

    With reference to the 85% premium to benefit - the only impact this will have is that premiums are going to go up across the board, as are co-pays.  This isn't going to reduce costs - in fact, it's going to do the opposite.  Do you really think that they're going to cut profits or executive salaries to make these goals?

    No cancellations and pre-existing conditions:  it doesn't matter if you are allowed (well, forced, really) to buy insurance that you can't afford to exercise.  Furthermore, care will continued to be dictated by cost: people will be forced to take the cheap and risky routes first.

    Kids may stay on parents plan:  ok, another nice shiney prize.  So we basically mandate the kids into early adulthood, instead of actually giving them a public option or medicare buy in.  We are still keeping the middleman here.

    Defined benefit levels in 3 govt controlled plans:  well, so it's not health care for all - it's still a tiered, class based layered system.  In other words, we manage to keep healthcare based on what you can buy.

    At the end of the day, all of this is just shiny wrapping to disguise the fact that we aren't getting reform.  We are being sold a bill of goods.

    This is not what was campaigned on, and this is not the health care reform that helped see President Obama elected and got the majorities that we (are supposed to) have in the House and Senate.

    This is not what we made calls and donations to get passed.  Rather, this is a bill written by lobbyists for the insurance industry with some shiny consolation prizes thrown in so you don't realize that you're trading the farm for some cheap nicities.

    And this is not what the independent and middle of the road voters want.

    This is a fiasco and a disaster, both politically and in terms of actual health care improvements.

    The inadequate is the enemy of the necessary.

    by JRandomPoster on Wed Feb 03, 2010 at 10:44:58 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  I'll adress your points one by one (0+ / 0-)
      1.  There is no benefit in increasing premiums if you must increase benefits by the same amount, that cant be a profit driver you'd have to find ways to keep shoveling money out the front door.  It's purpose is not to reduce its cost its purpose is to make sure Insurance companies are not just taking premium dollars while reducing benefit.
      1.  There is no mandate to purchase what you cannot afford and in fact are very generous subsidies for those who cannot afford it.  You do not at all speak to the fact that people who now cannot get coverage at any price will be able to under the Senate bill, you know those 45K Americans Grayson was discussing.
      1.  I don't think the kid who had asthma, or cancer or anyother of the thousands of childhood diseases thinks its a shiney bauble that his 23rd birthday isnt a death sentence.
      1.  The defined benefit is 60% of cost 80 and 90 I believe, and it will be a gauranteed performer that wont throw you off when you use it, I'd say one hell of a nice step forward

      At the end of the day its the HealthCare StepOne Act of 2010 and let's get er done.

      My leader is Barack Hussein Obama the finest President this country has ever elected.

      by Adept2u on Wed Feb 03, 2010 at 10:57:12 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Rebuttals: (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Uberbah
        1.  Cost will be aggregated across all policies.  We'll still be paying the executive salaries, the lobbyist fees, and shareholder profits to the middle man between us and our health care.  Similarly, any excise tax will be inherently shared with policy payers whose policy does not have such a tax added, as the cost of the non-excise tax policy can be escalated while the cost of the excise taxed policy can be slightly undervalued.  Overall, all we've done is set up a more efficient machine for the insurance industry to make profits.
        1.  Too many folks will have to go broke to get the subsidies and get on medicaid.  And setting up clinics is a different ball of wax than setting up a true national health care system.
        1.  They move it up to 26.  It's not a fix - it's a stay of execution.  It is not a solution.
        1.  And when the insurance companies use all their mandated profits to lobby without restriction?  When we get another Republican Congress, as someday we will, who thinks that everything needs to be de-regulated so it can thrive?

        At the end of the day, we aren't really changing much except for legally empowering the health insurance companies.  And you call it act one:  well, unless we actually get a real foundation to build upon, there won't be an act two.  And what they're trying to pawn off on us is not a real foundation by any stretch of the imagination.

        The inadequate is the enemy of the necessary.

        by JRandomPoster on Wed Feb 03, 2010 at 11:43:10 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  One other thing: (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Uberbah

        Regardless of whether you are right (and - really, I hope you are, but my engineer's mind looks at the plan and the politics, and cannot force itself to accept conclusions that are not supported by facts) - the voters aren't seeing it that way.

        Rather, they are seeing capitulation and failure to deliver what was promised.  And the more they learn about the Senate plan, the more discouraged they become - especially when what they don't see is the Democratic leadership fighting very hard a lot of the time.

        Maybe there is some hope to be had in the Senate Plan.  But - it's not enough.

        A lot of folks were willing to accept a certain level of compromise.  But what they are seeing is that the Democrats in power have traded away one thing after another for something else which in turn is then traded away.

        It's not too late to fix this bill and get it passed.  But if the bill that is before the Senate passes now, it will mean a massive loss for the Democrats.  And there will go your Act Two.

        The inadequate is the enemy of the necessary.

        by JRandomPoster on Wed Feb 03, 2010 at 11:49:28 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

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