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View Diary: UT Legislasture cheers sexual predator! (42 comments)

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  •  What would you call it (5+ / 0-)

    when a 15 year old girl is naked in the jacuzzi with her 30 year old boss????

    •  I'm not defending it - it was bad judgment on (0+ / 0-)

      multiple levels.  But I very much doubt it was a sex crime, even in 1985.  In the EU this would be a non-issue, but in the US we're really uptight about nudity, especially around minors.  I doubt this could even be prosecuted as indecent exposure since both parties were nude, and nudity is rather common in hot tubs.

      It's interesting that we're more focused on the nudity than the blackmail.

      •  Are you serious? (3+ / 0-)

        I doubt this could even be prosecuted as indecent exposure since both parties were nude, and nudity is rather common in hot tubs.

        Would you be so cool with it, if it was YOUR 15 year old daughter???

        •  Please cite a Utah statute which supports (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          debedb

          your position and would be in effect in 1985.

          In my hot tub we wear suits if children are present, but I've been in saunas and tubs in Germany, Finland and France where that wasn't the case, and no confusion of nudity and sexuality was made.

          •  I was not aware that this (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            vcmvo2

            was the DailyKos Legal Blog for lawyers only.

            I am truly sorry that I cannot quote off the top of my head 25 year old Utah state law.  I hope you will accept my apology.  So sorry!

            •  Then cite a current law which would prohibit it. (0+ / 0-)
              •  76-9-702. Lewdness -- Sexual battery -- Public (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                vcmvo2, skrekk, Richard Lyon

                76-9-702.   Lewdness -- Sexual battery -- Public urination.

                      (1)  A person is guilty of lewdness if the person under circumstances not amounting to rape, object rape, forcible sodomy, forcible sexual abuse, aggravated sexual assault, or an attempt to commit any of these offenses, performs any of the following acts in a public place or under circumstances which the person should know will likely cause affront or alarm to, on, or in the presence of another who is 14 years of age or older:
                      (a)  an act of sexual intercourse or sodomy;
                      (b)  exposes his or her genitals, the female breast below the top of the areola, the buttocks, the anus, or the pubic area;
                      (c)  masturbates; or
                      (d)  any other act of lewdness.
                      (2) (a)  A person convicted the first or second time of a violation of Subsection (1) is guilty of a class B misdemeanor, except under Subsection (2)(b).
                      (b)  A person convicted of a violation of Subsection (1) is guilty of a third degree felony if at the time of the violation:
                      (i)  the person is a sex offender as defined in Section 77-27-21.7;
                      (ii)  the person has been previously convicted two or more times of violating Subsection (1); or
                      (iii)  the person has previously been convicted of a violation of Subsection (1) and has also previously been convicted of a violation of Section 76-9-702.5.
                      (3)  A person is guilty of sexual battery if the person under circumstances not amounting to rape, rape of a child, object rape, object rape of a child, forcible sodomy, sodomy upon a child, forcible sexual abuse, sexual abuse of a child, aggravated sexual abuse of a child, aggravated sexual assault, or an attempt to commit any of these offenses intentionally touches, whether or not through clothing, the anus, buttocks, or any part of the genitals of another person, or the breast of a female, and the actor's conduct is under circumstances the actor knows or should know will likely cause affront or alarm to the person touched.
                      (4)  Sexual battery is a class A misdemeanor.
                      (5)  A person is guilty of public urination if the person urinates or defecates:
                      (a)  in a public place, other than a public rest room; and
                      (b)  under circumstances which the person should know will likely cause affront or alarm to another.
                      (6)  Public urination is a class C misdemeanor.
                      (7)  A woman's breast feeding, including breast feeding in any location where the woman otherwise may rightfully be, does not under any circumstance constitute a lewd act, irrespective of whether or not the breast is covered during or incidental to feeding.

            •  The reason I ask for a citation is because (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              GreatDane

              the claim is a crime was committed.  Poor judgment, obviously - but I doubt a crime.

    •  Mentoring? (0+ / 0-)

      There are several possibilities for criminal charges in this situation. Contributing to the delinquency of a minor springs to mind. I also find it extremely difficult to believe that they sat chastely in opposite sides of the hot tub. Sounds like somebody has been using the Bill Clinton dictionary.
         

      •  "they sat chastely in opposite sides..." (0+ / 0-)

        Maybe they did, maybe they didn't.  We do know he denies having even touched the girl, and we know that she's already violated the blackmailed confidentially agreement but hasn't made any statement contradicting his.

        I very much doubt charges of contributing to the delinquency of a minor could be brought, absent a violation of a state law by either party.  Poor judgment is not a crime.

        •  We now know (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          vcmvo2

          that the woman who was involved says that he was lying.

          Why don't you go peddle your campaign of sexual liberation somewhere else. it's isn't going to wash in this situation.

          •  You're the one who has claimed a crime. (0+ / 0-)

            Where is it?  And can you link to Maher's claim that Garn is lying about the incident, as there is no such claim in the article?  Why did Maher email Garn's wife to apologize?

            I think there's reason to doubt the statements of both sides - Garn obviously thought it was less than innocent because he told his wife, Maher because she waited seven years and then sought Garn out in an obvious blackmail attempt.  Why did Maher's husband advise trying to extort more hush money?  Why did she ask Garn to pay for a trip back to Utah in 2007 and then meet with him?

            I don't want to diminish the psychological complexity of real abuse cases, or question why an abused minor would wait many years before seeking justice.  I just doubt that's what going on here.

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