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  •  Selling Healthcare & shooting down talking Points (0+ / 0-)

    Here is one of my Facebook Conversation/Debate from the other day.....

    Here is her first response to ...

    Sherry

    I have read through all these comments, and I have to say you do come across quite angry. This is a very heated issue. I think most Americans want insurance reform. I am pleased that insurance companies will not be able to place limits on coverage, cannot deny based on pre-existing conditions and that children can be covered longer. I think these valid points could have been covered in a smaller, more efficient bill that didn't cause such a divide. I think many people, such as myself, are dismayed with the games and deals that were made to get this bill passed. A more concise bill would have had more support, within the Democrat party themselves. You may want to double check your facts. Yes, there is a tax credit for those businesses that provide medical to employees. However, the credit decreases beginning in the $25K range and completely goes away at $50K. Also, only companies with 50 or more employees will be required to provide insurance. It will be interesting to see how many companies will lay off people to avoid having to pay the insurance.

    A very interesting fact is that Medicare has the highest percentage of claims denied. This bill also does not allow for new doctors or hospitals, but it does allow for approximately 12,000 additional IRS agents. I haven't seen anything that provides evidence of improved healthcare, just more bureaucracy.

    Also, about taxes for those paying over $200K/year. That number was originally $250K/year. I doubt anyone believes anything coming from a politicians mouth. When we have seen numbers change as they have, it is not too far to imagine that tax increases can affect any of us. Also, I would like to point out that even people making a larger amount of money have expenses and budgets. Though they make more than others, they also have expenses based on their income. Yes, they make more, but they also have a larger mortgage, more property taxes, and other expenses. Sympathy may not need to be given, but understand that just because they make more than you doesn't mean they don't also live on a budget. Those extra taxes will be taken from somewhere else, such as charitable giving, household help (yes, people will fire housing staff causing more unemployment) and shopping... economic stimulation. It is very easy to place responsibility on others, but remember that there are people out there that would just as quickly expect you to do more because you are in a better financial situation than them. I'm just not a fan of over-taxing anyone. ... See More

    Regarding Jeff's comment on education, he didn't seem to be against education, just against people receiving preferential treatment. I agree with him. When my children are ready for college, I would like them to be considered for their academics, extra-curricular and other standard admission requirements.

    •  Selling Healthcare & Shooting Down Talking Points (0+ / 0-)

      And here is my response to her

      @Sherry, oh dear heart is this really a serious statement:

      "I have read through all these comments, and I have to say you do come across quite angry. This is a very heated issue. I think most Americans want insurance reform. I am pleased that insurance companies will not be able to place limits on coverage, cannot deny based on pre-existing conditions and that children can be covered longer. I think these valid points could have been covered in a smaller, more efficient bill that didn't cause such a divide."

      Really, "I think these valid points could have been covered in a smaller, more efficient bill that didn’t cause such a divide" (OMG if ever there were a more laughable statement it is this.... )

      Oh and this one: "I think many people, such as myself, are dismayed with the games and deals that were made to get this bill passed. A more concise bill would have had more support, within the Democrat party themselves. " (LOL, did John Boehner or Eric Cantor call you up personally with these talking points, Republican Spin and Scare Tactic or did you plagiarize Sarah Palin’s Facebook ...Awe come honey you have to be a little more original than this, but what am I saying, this is what yah do!!!!)

      The Spin Continues:

      Oh and we have this little statement: "You may want to double check your facts. Yes, there is a tax credit for those businesses that provide medical to employees. However, the credit decreases beginning in the $25K range and completely goes away at $50K. Also, only companies with 50 or more employees will be required to provide insurance. It will be interesting to see how many companies will lay off people to avoid having to pay the insurance." (Well I guess we will have to see how this plays out won’t we, unless you have a crystal ball, you wanna tell me about...)

      Mary Elizabeth I’m curious, who are you pointing the partisan finger at, wait let me guess, the Democrats and President Obama? and like everything else the Republicans have been wrong on so far, you might as well add that selective perspective to the list as well.

      Let’s be real here, the Republicans were never honest broker s in this Healthcare debate and if they were, they were too scared to show it; it was Jim DeMint who wanted this to be President Obama’s Waterloo, they wanted to break him but in the end, they broke themselves of any type of credibility. You even had Olympia Snowe, who originally wanted to be on the right side of history chose to be on the wrong side with Failures, and all because she feared being retaliated against by the Teabagger Crowd and don’t get me start on John McCain the Maverick, who now looks like a crazy old man. So please spare me your delusional perception on how "YOU" think this bill should have been written. Your way Elizabeth Mary, would have been impossible to implement when you are dealing with a party of cowards.

      If Republicans truly cared about Americans having Affordable Decent Healthcare Insurance then why haven’t they ever presented a Healthcare Bill of their own; they controlled Congress and the Whitehouse for the last ten years until President Obama took over, so where was their Bill?

      I know, I know, you have no answers as to why, why until now are we suppose to believe they give a shit; we are suppose to just embrace their plan when they’ve never had a plan before. 10 years of opportunity to do something really Historic and what did they squander it on, Tax Cuts for the Rich, not Healthcare Reform, Tax Cuts for the rich and so tell me, how is that working out for ya...?

      They weren’t even competent to handle the No Child Left Behind Program but let’s embrace their ideas on healthcare reform and let s make the bill short because what, they have intellectually short attention spans, my god this is so comical to me.

      Now we get President Obama and a Democratic House and Senate (Although the Senate leaves much to be desired) and things are actually beginning to happen positively for the American People. Now granted it maybe a little slower than some would like but hey, I kind of, like a few of things that have taken place since President Obama has been in office (won’t bore you with more facts).

      But Healthcare reform, you can’t go wrong with that and after the conversation

      I had this morning with a close friend, she kind of like it too... You see I had to clear some things up for her. She is a Religious Church going person and she has her occasional habits of listening to talk radio and at times she finds herself buying into what they are saying and so she had a few questions for me that were concerning her:

      • People are going to stop their health Insurance Coverage so that they could get Free Healthcare Insurance. (Of course, we all know this is a lie... I broke it down on how the poor get free healthcare insurance because they are poor and the Rich get great healthcare insurance because they are rich but it is the Middle Class who suffers; this bill will allow Middle Class to buy into a more affordable Healthcare Exchange similar to what Congress has.)

      But

      you know what really excited my friend, it was when I told her that you could keep your children on your insurance coverage until they turn 26. She has a 21 23 24 olds who are in college but have no health insurance (and I won’t tell you her reaction to the College Student Aid Provision, let’s just say : ) ......)

      But you see that wasn’t the only thing that made her happy,

      she was comforted to know that her Senior Citizen Mother won’t have to go broke paying for her prescription drugs anymore because that loophole is being closed up. I must admit she was really excited because she kept asking more and more questions (Facts are a beautiful thing) and once I finished explaining everything else to her, get this; she wanted to know when does this all take affects and if could I email her a copy of the Healthcare Reform Bill, which I was happy to answer and very pleased to do.

      You see Sherry, I don’t really care about your selective perception or spin, the bottom line is, Republicans and Teabaggers have never been sincere on Healthcare Reform because if you or they were, this would have already been law before President Obama was ever Senator Obama... 10 years and you provided nothing but a Tax cut for the rich.... 10 Years..... Now people are slowly finding out that this Healthcare Reform Bill isn’t the Boggy Man your group was making it out to be.

      And here we are a year and some change later and you want to bitch about process. Oh Dear Soul, you really need to pull away from Fox News and try to figure out away to come up with your own points of views otherwise you ended up handicapping yourself from engaging in an honest discussion. When all you have are talking points and insults, you weaken your credibility to be taken seriously.

      So once again, you can go ahead and call my facts angry words because you are do nothing but shooting blanks; but that is what happens when you run on offering nothing and then sit back and complain for offering nothing....

      By the way Sherry, If facts are the new definition for angry, well then, I will wear that titled with a badge of honor... You might want to try it sometimes, they help you from sounding foolish....
      March 23 at 2:16pm ·

      •  Selling Healthcare and Shooting Down Talking Poin (0+ / 0-)

        And her reply to me

        Sweet, sweet ,I Knows A Lot... get your facts straight! I am not quoting anything from Palin, or anyone else. Believe it or not, I have done the research and come to my own conclusions. I don't have time to reply to every part of your hysterical rant, but let me touch on a few... First of all, Democrats have been in control of Congress ... See Moresince 2007. Second, full time college students qualify for medical care through their school. Third, I am middle class, not rich, and I have been very pleased with my health insurance. My crystal ball may not tell the future, but it can remember history and human nature. As I said, I like some of the requirements of the bill. As an educated and intelligent woman I am able to accept that nothing will ever be perfect for everyone. This, however, was not a solid bill and should not have become law just to play a political game. To blindly go along with party line, whichever side you chose to partner, is ignorant and shows lack of character. To ignore the facts that you don't agree with shows that you don't want a true debate, you want to resort to condescending wording and emotional rhetoric. Healthcare reform is not what bothers those of us who are against this bill. Support for parts of this bill are unilateral. Healthcare and insurance reform are necessary. All that this has accomplished is a more divided nation and a whole lot of lawsuits. You can get back on your condescending high horse and pretend you have a clue, but you clearly are too busy spouting your party beliefs and not willing really look at the flaws of this bill. I have never been one to just follow party lines. I believe that being so devoted to a party can cause one to lose touch with reality. You have a mind, use it

        •  Selling Healthcare & Shooting Down Talking Points (0+ / 0-)

          And Here are my replies to her

          Oh Sherry, yes, yes, yes you have done your research. I honestly believe this is true; but exactly where did you do your research. Did you keep searching and searching until you found the information that supported your ideology, or did you pursue this with an opened mind, come Sherry you can tell me.... If you have links or website you care to share, I am open to reading them....

          Now with that being said, let’s talk about this interesting new synonym you seem to have once again created for me, "HYSTERICAL RANT". Sherry, you don't have time to reply to Hysterical Rant, Is this another definition for FACTS... Come on Missy, you are going to have to slow down; I can't keep up with your constant definition changes...

          Now that we have gotten that out the way, let’s address a few things:...

          You say Democrats Controlled Congress since 2007:

          • (Very Close by not quite, the question is, did the Democrats control both Chambers of Congress and the Whitehouse in since 2007 and I believe they did not but we will go ahead and give you a pass on this one. I know it can get confusing sometimes, since the House of Representative do majority of the work and the Senate is where Bills go to die, isn’t that what they say. Here are here are the FACTS aka Hysterical Rants: I now may be mistaken on this my memory is a little fuzzy, so please correct me if you can but in 2007, The Senate was 49 Democrat, 49 Republican and two Independent, LIEberman and Sanders and Dick Cheney to break any tie, now the House of Representative is where you are absolutely correct on, the Democrat did control the House but don’t forget that Bush was still President and knowing what we now know about the Republicans unwillingness to provide healthcare coverage for 32 million Uninsured Americans, could we honestly expected them to pass Healthcare Reform in 2007 when they would even come to the table in Good Faith in 2010. Come on Sherry, you can possibly be suggesting that Healthcare Reform could have taken under a divided Senate, Democratic House and a Republican President, now you even know better than that)

          Now let us talk about your point on Full Time Students and Medicare:

          • (This is great if you are a Full-time Student but it is not great if you are a part time student or a part time worker who happens to be under the age of 26 and cannot get or afford Healthcare Insurance, so your argument it is wasted because it is based on some young adults and not all.)

      •  Selling Healthcare & Shooting Down Talking Points (0+ / 0-)

        My replies continue

        Okay Sherry where did I leave off,

        So let’s touch upon this statement: "I am middle class, not rich, and I have been very pleased with my health insurance."

        • (Now you might not have heard this and this might be Breaking News , but if you like your Healthcare Insurance, well guess what, you get to keep it, yeah I was pretty excited to learn that too, I mean even if you lost your job or moved to a new job, you now can take your coverage with you. Just imagine being stuck in a job from hell but can’t leave because they have a good healthcare program, well now you are no longer held hostage in a nightmare job. )... See More
        But let’s talk about affordability for those who like their Healthcare.

        • (Quality of your Healthcare seems to fall in line with mine; It’s great and we love it and we get to keep it, but I am having a problem with this Premium Increase thing; It seems to be one of the road blocks that prevents employers from giving decent amounts of salary increases . Because your employers has to pay out so much money toward the high cost of Healthcare Insurance guess who that ends up hurting, you, me, the employee. Let’s just say your job typically gives out 3 to7 % raises well what ends up happening is that percentage gets cut in half because yours, mine and the employee’s healthcare insurance has shot up, Employers are about making money and not giving it away unless they can take it away from you and so what you end-up with is your raise being affect because you are being hit at both ends making pay raises a wash. I don’t know about you but I am personally having trouble with this High Premium Cost Thing,; Just to be blunt, the Shit is High, but if you prefer paying high premiums, I don't think anyone would begrudge if you wanted to keep on doing so and I'm pretty sure Insurance Companies would be quite please at that concept but me on the other hand, well I kind of like having extra money.....)

        We have come upon the Kill the Bill Section: "As I said, I like some of the requirements of the bill. As an educated and intelligent woman I am able to accept that nothing will ever be perfect for everyone. This, however, was not a solid bill and should not have become law just to play a political game."

        • (Tell Sherry what original bill is solid, none that I can think of.... Not Civil Rights, Women Rights, Gay Rights, Veteran’s Rights, Social Security, Medicare/Medical etc., show me any Bill that has been passed and signed into Law that has stayed in its original form; I think you would be hard pressed to locate that Bill.... Everything has a start and now so does Healthcare...

        Healthcare: "Healthcare Reform is not what bothers those of us who are against this bill. Support for parts of this bill are unilateral"

        • (Okay, so we've found a place of agreement , let me move on to your next point)

        Oh but wait, The Big Divided: "Healthcare reform is not what bothers those of us who are against this bill. Support for parts of this bill are unilateral All that this has accomplished is a more divided nation and a whole lot of lawsuits."

        • (Those who created the divide were the Republican Party, when they chose the reckless calculation of obstructionism instead of coming to the table in Good Faith. They allowed themselves to be taken over by the Corporation Controlled Teabagging Party; so on the Great Divide, the Republican have their own selves to blame.... )

        Party Line: "I have never been one to just follow party lines. I believe that being so devoted to a party can cause one to lose touch with reality"

        • (Well Party line is something I do not do. That is why I supported President Obama when he was Candidate Obama and when everyone else in my party was supporting Hillary Clinton and my second choice happened to be the man he chose for Vice-President, Joe Biden. Now that's a Lotto Pick there because no one saw it coming.

        But can I let you in on a little secret, but If I tell you, you can't tell anyone or my Democratic Reputation would be ruin, but I've voted for a few Republicans, but this is just between you and I...

        • And this might surprise you that I use to like John McCain well until he turned into a hateful Republican;

        • And then there is Mitt Romney, you can't be Governor of Mass and be all that bad, but the problem with Mitt is that he doesn't have a charming oral about himself ;he is stiff, come across as an intellectual snob which can put people off. I mean I could look passed it but others can't. But here is what did it in for me, Romney to turned into a Hateful Republican in order to run for office and what it showed like it did with John McCain, Sarah Palin is that you would sell your soul to the Devil and give up your core beliefs and principles in order to win and why would anyone want someone like that representing their country, it shows you to be nothing more than a coward.

        March 23 at 7:36pm

      •  Selling Healthcare & Shooting Down Talking Points (0+ / 0-)

        And my final reply

        Condescending: ... See More

        "you want to resort to condescending wording and emotional rhetoric." or" You can get back on your condescending high horse and pretend you have a clue, but you clearly are too busy spouting your party beliefs and not willing really look at the flaws of this bill"

        • (I've noticed you've used this Condescending Word Twice, I assuming my approach to these conversations has bothered you somewhat. And if so, for that I apologize but if I can provide you with a technique that you might find useful it would probably be Thicker Skin. Thicker Skin is something you might want to invest in when you originate a comment to an individual’s that begins with an attempt to insult them because you see, from that point on you've basically set the energy on how the remaining conversations would take place)

        And you also might want to practice what you preach in terms of following the party line because everything you have listed and every comment you have made, indicates that you need to be in search of the nearest mirror because you have some major reflection and self-examination you need to work on.... There is nothing in your comments that has indicated to me, that you have been opened -minded in this debate, especially when you use words insincere words like Divide, because it showed that you followed the pattern of coming to the table not in good faith but with talking points...
        March 23 at 7:41pm ·

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