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View Diary: When is violent assault not violent assault? (88 comments)

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  •  This is why I was talking to you yesterday... (14+ / 0-)

    ...about Pink Pistols.

    I think we're well overdue for a LGBT Black Panthers-like organization.  We live in a society where there simply is no dispute that the legal system and fellow citizens will not protect LGBT persons.  And I feel that it is long past time someone did.

    The urge to save humanity is almost always a false face for the urge to rule it. ~ H.L. Mencken

    by Jay Elias on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 04:49:21 PM PDT

    •  Ya know, I'm a completely nonviolent person (7+ / 0-)

      by nature, but I totally understand what you mean.  I don't know what it takes in the face of a legal framework that protects us in theory but so often fails to do so in practice.  

      Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

      by pico on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 04:59:49 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  See, I'm anti-aggression... (6+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        pico, buddabelly, luckydog, blueoasis, crose, kyril

        ...not anti-violence.

        There are rare circumstances where violence is required in genuine self-defense.  The law is the tool of the powerful; as you know, those who don't have power, such as the poor and disfavored minorities, get the business end of the law and that alone.

        I have neither the time nor the energy to waste worrying about what the law should be.  There is a need that the law does not fill.  So something else must.

        The urge to save humanity is almost always a false face for the urge to rule it. ~ H.L. Mencken

        by Jay Elias on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 05:03:28 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yeah, we've got nothing like that. (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Jay Elias, buddabelly, luckydog, kyril

          I wonder if we face an organizational challenge because of the nature of the community (more spread out, less coherent/cohesive than racial communities).  There was a brief moment when it might have been possible: Vanguard.

          Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

          by pico on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 05:09:24 PM PDT

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          •  The Stonewall riots are another example... (5+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            pico, buddabelly, luckydog, blueoasis, kyril

            ...I think a big part of why things like this don't get done is because it is really distasteful to have to do, and because it comes at a cost, often high, to those who perform it.  Look at what happened to the actual leaders of the Black Panthers, for instance.  The dispersal of the LGBT community might be a part of it; I don't know that I know enough to do it.

            Still, I think at some point, it has to be done.  I don't care if people do it themselves or if they hire Blackwater's non-utterly evil equivalent to do it for them.

            The urge to save humanity is almost always a false face for the urge to rule it. ~ H.L. Mencken

            by Jay Elias on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 05:14:04 PM PDT

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      •  I'm the same way ... (6+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        zett, Nowhere Man, pico, buddabelly, kyril, elginblt

        And cases like this test my nonviolence.

        I commented about this, this morning.

        Not really sure what to say about this. I don't believe in punishment, but I am scared of impunity, and doubly scared in cases like this.

        We need to be more concerned with violence from people in power, including police officers, and we need to be more concerned with violence against people who are seen as expendable in this society, including poor trans womyn of color. Unfortunately, as a society, we tend to be less concerned.

        Accountability shouldn't begin or end with the officers involved. It should go after the system.

        http://www.dailykos.com/...

        Remember Duanna Johnson. Tortured by the Memphis PD for being black and trans. Killed by the Memphis PD for speaking up.

        by Marja E on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 05:07:40 PM PDT

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      •  It's not just failing to protect us (5+ / 0-)

        As bad as that is, this is worse: systemic aggression against us, from the one system that is permitted lawful use of force in this country.

        And it is systemic. What's caught on tape is only a tiny portion of what actually happens.

        Every horror committed by man begins with the lie that some man is not a man. - Jyrinx

        by kyril on Tue Apr 20, 2010 at 06:33:16 PM PDT

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    •  I absolutely abhor vigilante justice. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      pico, buddabelly

      I see it as people viewing themselves above the law, either like some kind of Batman or cowboy figure acting mostly out of their own personal desire for violence rather than an honest need to see justice served.  In a civilized society this is not the way it's supposed to work.

      However... what you're saying makes perfect sense.  If there are no true advocates for the LGBT community and the cops are more part of the problem than the solution then someone is gonna need to step up.  So, for what it's worth I would support this.

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