Skip to main content

View Diary: Ohio Primary: Dems Take a Dive, and a Dive, and a Dive, and.... (164 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  umm... (0+ / 0-)

    Burke and Lane said they had heard it from "several sources." So apparently you think they are lying. I have no way of knowing who is right and who is wrong, and as far as I can tell, you don't either.

    It pushes the people here far to the right because it shows Democrats to be liars.

    I don't even understand that. In your version, Jean Schmidt came up with these lies about Krikorian, the Democratic leaders climbed on board for their own purposes, and the effect is that people reject the lies, rage at the Democrats, and move toward Schmidt?!

    •   Um no, yoiu have it wrong (0+ / 0-)

      Burke and Lane FIRST said that they heard it from "other Democrats," when they told their story to the Cincinnati Enquirer, which printed the story unethically because real journalism requires contact with the actual source, not pure hearsay.

      So then Burke and Lane were pressed on the matter, including by my diary pointing out the journalistic transgression.

      At that point they CHANGED their story and said that the "other Democrats" were one other Democrat, namely Lane himself, who was allegedly "reminded" by the Schmidt letter of a private conversation he had with Krikorian more than two months earlier.  This invention was required because they could not produce any "other Democrat" who had heard the ridiculous allegation.

      If the new version is true, which it ain't, why did Dave Lane take a reminder from Schmidt to convince him that Krikorian's earlier comments were racist?

      This story was accepted superficially only by self-styled "progressives" far away, eager to believe that a south Ohio maverick would also be a racist.

      But it was immediately recognized by voters here as a fabrication -- a. because we know Schmidt's and Lane's records of inventing facts, and b. because we've heard David Krikorian speak about the meaning of his grandparents' experience with genocide. The idea that Krikorian is "racist" is tenable only if you don't know Dave Krikorian.

      And for those reasons, the mass of the electorate here -- including mainly Independents -- is now totally convinced that the ODP is a pack of lying scoundrels.

      "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

      by Ohiobama on Wed May 05, 2010 at 03:22:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  you must be joking (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        DCCyclone

        Look, I have no opinion about Burke and Lane. But what you're saying about voters' reaction makes very little sense, unless "voters" means something like "me and the folks at the diner."

        I'm going to go out on a limb here and speculate that the vast majority of voters in the district don't know Dave Krikorian.

        •  I think you've missed (0+ / 0-)

          that Krikorian criss-crossed the district twice -- in 2008 and in 2010. He spent the intervening year preparing his 2010 run.

          Schmidt filed charges against him based on his assertions about the Armenian Genocide, so those issues played out in all district newspapers over a long time period, with Schmidt basically smearing him for being Armenian, and other Democrats mocking his "funny name."

          So yes, district voters did know that David Krikorian was the last person in the world to mock a candidate's name. It was just ludicrous.

          And that is precisely why Burke and Lane only acted when they were given that fraudulent letter by Jean Schmidt.

          It was a set-up. Classic and unbelievably scuzzy. Burke and Lane jumped in bed with Schmidt.

          Only the smug "progressives" were fooled.

          "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

          by Ohiobama on Wed May 05, 2010 at 04:25:15 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  problems with your account: (0+ / 0-)

            (1) It doesn't explain why Krikorian lost.

            (2) It doesn't explain why voters would hold Burke and Lane accountable, but not Schmidt.

            (3) It doesn't explain why Burke and Lane, who presumably know a thing or two about politics in their counties, did something that apparently was not only "unbelievably scuzzy," but strikingly stupid and self-destructive.

            The last one may not need explanation: people do strikingly stupid things fairly often. But, still.

            •  Read the diary again (0+ / 0-)

              Turnout was EXTREMELY light. Light turnout affects rural counties much more than urban -- just a rule.

              In normal primaries, Hamilton County makes up between 25% and 40% of the Dem. vote. In this election it made up about 45%. That is why Krikorian lost. Less than 20,000 people voted for either Yalamanchili or Krikorian -- in a district that has a population of around 700,000.

              The slander itself was ineffective. What made it effective was that the Cincinnati Enquirer carried it as front-page news. Unfortunately, many people, especially in Hamilton County, only paid enough attention to see that "lots of people" were making accusations against Krikorian. Typical story.

              The charges were intentionally made only days before the primary. That was done to prevent an effective response, such as from the veterans present at the meeting. Getting the true facts out takes time.

              OF COURSE people hold Schmidt responsible. We all know she's a pathological liar. But what's the choice now? Yalamanchili is the guy who sent out the slander in hit-mailers. The election choice is now between two co-conspirators. And that's why people will blame the Democratic Party for capitulating.  And by the way, while Krikorian spent his entire time attacking Schmidt, Yalamanchili spent the primary attacking Krikorian.

              And the 59% who voted for John McCain certainly don't care that Jean Schmidt pulled off some successful sabotage of the Democrats.

              As to (3): The thing about county Democratic committees under a corrupt regime as we have in Ohio is that they perpetually defend against insurgency as their principal mission. They purge and purge, even as they dwindle to insignificance.

              You should realize that the Clermont County Democratic Party is miniscule. It's one of the most Republican counties in the state and was the county under most suspicion in the 2004 election-fraud fiasco.

              "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

              by Ohiobama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:40:55 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  so "smug 'progressives'" morphed into (0+ / 0-)

                the Hamilton Co. Democratic electorate?

                I have few preconceptions about the right answers here. I just see your answers wobbling all over the place. Maybe we can revisit this subject when you've calmed down.

                •  No wobble (0+ / 0-)

                  It's hard to convey the geography to someone who really doesn't know the lay of the land here, as you seem not to.

                  This district is extremely bipolar. The urban east end in Cincinnati is cosmopolitan, with small but typical mixes of ethnic groups, a gay community, etc.

                  The entire rest of the district, accounting for maybe 85%, is rural or suburban, conservative, evangelical -- including the Democrats.

                  In an extremely light election year, Yalamanchili won by turning out a sizable fraction of that small 15% in the urban east end, assisted by the lies of Tim Burke, the county chairman. He sent out repeated hit mailers against Krikorian, accusing Krikorian of being "pro-life" (false) and "anti-gay marriage" (true but so is every other Democrat east of Cincinnati, including the governor).

                  Okay, so Yalamanchili inflamed 10,000 progressives, most of them in Hamilton County.  Big deal. That's a microscopic speck when it comes to the general, and even many of those people, who are smug because they look down on Appalachians, will realize their error in the coming weeks, as the truth comes out.

                  The Democratic honchos who did this now have an openly pro-gay marriage, lying, "celebrity" rich-kid to sell to struggling evangelical Appalachians.

                  The party brand is destroyed here. It will be entertaining to watch. It will set back progressivism by decades in this district.

                  "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

                  by Ohiobama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 05:59:26 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                •  No wobble (0+ / 0-)

                  It's hard to convey the geography to someone who really doesn't know the lay of the land here, as you seem not to.

                  This district is extremely bipolar. The urban east end in Cincinnati is cosmopolitan, with small but typical mixes of ethnic groups, a gay community, etc.

                  The entire rest of the district, accounting for maybe 85%, is rural or suburban, conservative, evangelical -- including the Democrats.

                  In an extremely light election year, Yalamanchili won by turning out a sizable fraction of that small 15% in the urban east end, assisted by the lies of Tim Burke, the county chairman. He sent out repeated hit mailers against Krikorian, accusing Krikorian of being "pro-life" (false) and "anti-gay marriage" (true but so is every other Democrat east of Cincinnati, including the governor).

                  Okay, so Yalamanchili inflamed 10,000 progressives, most of them in Hamilton County.  Big deal. That's a microscopic speck when it comes to the general, and even many of those people, who are smug because they look down on Appalachians, will realize their error in the coming weeks, as the truth comes out.

                  The Democratic honchos who did this now have an openly pro-gay marriage, lying, "celebrity" rich-kid to sell to struggling evangelical Appalachians.

                  The party brand is destroyed here. It will be entertaining to watch. It will set back progressivism by decades in this district.

                  "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

                  by Ohiobama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 06:00:53 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  As an example (0+ / 0-)

                    A very important constituency here is the veterans community. Krikorian had the only vets group endorsement, and he spoke at many vets events including the VFW, where the alleged "incident" occured.

                    Of course, there was no incident. Schmidt lied.

                    What do you think will happen when Yalamanchili approaches the veterans for their support, after having lied about an incident at a VFW meeting that never happened?

                    What do you think those veterans will say?

                    "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

                    by Ohiobama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 06:16:53 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

            •  And another thing (0+ / 0-)

              I don't think that Burke and Lane really thought they would beat Krikorian. The goal was to damage him, so that as the nominee, the party would not have to give him money, and he would not actually win in November. Yalamanchili was just a tool for that.

              I think they are quite surprised by the election result. And the joke on them is that they now own the candidacy of a 28-year old race-baiting enfant terrible who came out supporting gay marriage -- in a district that has one of the highest percentages of evangelicals in the nation.

              It's pretty funny.

              "Politics: The conduct of public affairs for private advantage." -- Ambrose Bierce

              by Ohiobama on Thu May 06, 2010 at 02:48:49 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site