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View Diary: Wrecking Arizona for a law that doesn't solve the problem (206 comments)

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  •  A lot of that testimony (4+ / 0-)

    reeks of exaggeration and just making shit up.

    300-1200 illegal migrants a day??? Finding copies of the Quran??? Seriously?  

    First of all if we were to believe this stuff and do the math, using his rough estimate of a minimum of 300 people a day would mean a minimum of 109,000 people every year. That's more than 20% of the estimated yearly total of illegal immigrants to this country. It would mean a more or less steady flow across his property and the trails would probably be clearly visible from space. An enterprising person would set up a bottled water stand.

    Secondly it's highly unlikely they'd find any copies of the Quran. Firstly the main religion in Mexico is Christianity in form of Catholicism, and while I don't doubt there are Muslims in Mexico, they are rare and it's highly unlikely a devout Muslim would leave his or her copy of the Quran laying in the middle of nowhere unless it was accidentally dropped, which in that case you're probably far more likely to find copies of the Bible.

    That has to be one of the stupidest letters ever written by an adult.

    When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. -Jimi Hendrix -6.0 -5.33

    by Cali Techie on Mon May 10, 2010 at 12:20:19 PM PDT

    •  By the way (0+ / 0-)

      300 people crossing per day is roughly one every 5 minutes. Seems to me ICE could just set up an outpost and catching unlawful immigrants would be like fishing in a barrel.

      1200 a day would be roughly one every 72 seconds.

      Just from his property alone...

      When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. -Jimi Hendrix -6.0 -5.33

      by Cali Techie on Mon May 10, 2010 at 01:51:20 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  there are hundreds of thousands arrested in the (0+ / 0-)

      Tucson sector alone each year. Last year was light traffic as our economy has sucked so not as many jobs. Still over a quarter million arrests in the Tucson sector alone.

      Your numbers aren't even close to the reality here. The rancher may have exaggerated a little but not much.

      As for the Quran There are thousands of what the BP calls OTMs Other than Mexican that the cartels smuggle over every year. And yes some are from places like Pakistan where Islam is predominant so the chances there is the occasional copy is not impossible.

      I remember hearing about it at the time they were found and that was years ago.

      •  Budda, I remember when that story (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        buddabelly

        was making the rounds, probably about three years ago. I tried very hard to find a source for that claim, but basically it was all newsmax and WND. Supposedly it was part of testimony at a congressional hearing by a border sherrif, but I never could find anything to back up such testimony.

        But I agree, there are plenty of non hispanics being smuggled.

        Also, I think too many people here are just not getting the anxiety of those who live along the border.

        The Feds really do need to act. The coyotes are getting more and more viscious and there are some pretty ugly things happening.

        •  Hey MM how's it going, .yeah it's easy for some (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mariachi mama

          to flat trash the entire state for a few republicans from the Valley but there is a problem here as you know and lately it's really getting crazier than normal.

          If the Krentz shooting was actually a retaliatory strike, that's a new twist and some seriously bad JuJu. So many of the older smarter guys have been killed that I'm afraid the even crazier true crazies are taking over the operations. I was talking to a buddy the other day who said it's getting even worse across the line and the zetas are flat running roughshod over everything, hell he'll barely go down to Altar or Cananea anymore.

          If some young Jefe decides that he's going to start teaching people lessons on this side.........

          You're still in Sur right? hopefully far enough south to be out of the path, just the local stuff I hope....

          •  I know of three people (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            buddabelly

            down here who have been murdered by the drug wars. One was a guy my husband worked with and he was tortured to death and dumped about 5 blocks from our house. Since he worked at the airport, it is suspected that he was either involved or the cartels were tring to get him invoved in smuggling.

        •  Sorry totally got distracted. Yeah quite (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mariachi mama

          possibly the Quran thing was made up but the way it's being portrayed here as flat impossible is just infuriating as there's been Pakastani's and Huigars just off the top of my head who've been picked up right here in the valley.

          I remember talking about it at the time and as I remember you're right, there was never anything provable behind any of it.  Unfortunately the 17 bodies is more than just possible.

          One good part of the down economy is less people dying in the desert each year. Too many still but until the Fed side moves everyone's screwed.

          I'm just tired of all the anti Az crap lately here. So much ignorance and hate supposedly to stop ignorance and hate....meh....

          Glad to see you still here

      •  Maybe I'm wrong on the total number (0+ / 0-)

        but still that many going through ONE PERSON'S Property?

        Then there should be millions coming in just through Arizona alone. That doesn't count Califronia, New Mexico, & Texas, which has the longest border with Mexico.

        If these numbers were accurate the entire population of Mexico would be in the US in less than 10 years and no one would live down there.

        He probably gets no more than 200-300 illegal migrants crossing his property every year.

        When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. -Jimi Hendrix -6.0 -5.33

        by Cali Techie on Mon May 10, 2010 at 03:15:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Arizona gets over half of all the traffic in the (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mariachi mama, Cali Techie

          country every year. Tucson sector alone gets more than any other state.

          This is due to the way the laws are enforced and really took off when Operation Gatekeeper was implemented to push the migration out of the cities.

          People don't travel alone. They are in groups from 5-50 and if the rancher owns a major pathway like through the Altar valley then his numbers might not be far off. Also consider the ranch may have dozens of miles of border or more. Some ranches out here are pretty big.

          He may have been exaggerating but possibly not by much as if they catch that many, how many do you think get through?  

          We aren't an end destination for either people or drugs for the most part. We are just the pathway........

          •  Okay, I'll concede the numbers (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            buddabelly

            but copies of the Quaran?

            When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. -Jimi Hendrix -6.0 -5.33

            by Cali Techie on Mon May 10, 2010 at 11:08:23 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  read the comments between mariachi mama and I (0+ / 0-)

              The Quran reports were a couple years ago and quite possibly false. There is also the possibility of truth as there've been both Pakastani and Huigar people arrested within 15 miles of my house during the long walk.

              look for any reports listing quantities of OTM (other than Mexican) undocumented migrants........

    •  It sounds like either Glenn Spencer (0+ / 0-)

      or Roger Barnett.  Spencer is founder of American Border Patrol, which is listed as a hate group by the SPLC.  Barnett is a local a@@clown who has been known to hold at gunpoint anyone he suspects of being "illegal," which is pretty much anyone who's brown.  A few years ago he was sued by a Navy veteran and his relatives whom Barnett held at gunpoint on federal land that Barnett had leased.  The guy, his father, his daughter and her friend were hunting on thw federal land.  Barnett had to pay nearly $100K.

      The way to combat noxious ideas is with other ideas. The way to combat falsehoods is with truth. - William O. Douglas

      by PSzymeczek on Mon May 10, 2010 at 04:44:03 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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