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View Diary: A review of Jonathan Alter's book on Obama's first year. (135 comments)

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  •  The continuation of torture policies (13+ / 0-)

    exist solely in your head, and in the heads of others who for some strange reason have decided to secede from the reality based community.  All the evidence proves that torture has ended -- the executive orders, mainstream media reporting, the absence of even one person alleging they have been tortured, even the first hand accounts of Afghan detainees quoted in the NY Times magazine.

    Why some on the left just desperately want to hope against hope that torture is continuing is utterly beyond my comprehension.

    Obama ended Bush's torture policies.  Period.

    •  you don't know that (1+ / 0-)
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      and you won't know that unless there is a full investigation of what happened during the Bush Administration at Bagram and Guantanamo.  This May 17 piece by Scott Horton at Harper's points to what appears to be continued "rough treatment" at Bagram that is prohibited by the Geneva Conventions.

      Marc Ambinder reports that the secret prison at the periphery of Bagram is actually operated by the Defense Intelligence Agency:

      The Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) runs a classified interrogation facility for high-value detainees inside Bagram Air Field in Afghanistan, defense and administration officials said, and prisoners there are sometimes subject to tougher interrogation methods than those used elsewhere...

      It has been previously reported that the facility, beige on the outside with a green gate, was operated by members of a Joint Special Operations Command (JSOC) group, allegedly outside of Hayward’s jurisdiction. But JSOC, a component command made up of highly secret special mission units and task forces, does not operate the facility. Instead, it is manned by intelligence operatives and interrogators who work for the DIA’s Defense Counterintelligence and Human Intelligence Center (DCHC). They perform interrogations for a sub-unit of Task Force 714, an elite counter-terrorism brigade.

      Ambinder also reports that the rough interrogation techniques used at the prison are taken from the notorious Appendix M to the Army Field Manual, which the Pentagon itself acknowledges is not compliant with the Geneva Conventions standards for prisoners of war.

      Besides, even if the torture policies did end with Obama's executive order, there's still two big problems with it:

      1. That will not stop a future Republican Administration from issuing an executive order making waterboarding legal again.  Nothing will be able to prevent it as effectively as a full criminal investigation of the perpetrators of those crimes.
      1. The executive order does not in any way excuse the Obama Administration from continuing to deny prisoners at Guantanamo and Bagram their due process and hold them indefinitely out of concern that they're supposedly dangerous terrorists.  Most of those who have been held their indefinitely against their will at Guantanamo with no due process have actually been found to be wrongly seized.
      •  Like I don't know Obama doesn't eat children (0+ / 0-)

        This is the fall back position of the morons who think torture is continuing.  They say well, the Obama administration says it has ended torture, not one single solitary "victim" has come forward alleging torture, the executive orders have been issued forbidding torture, the prisoners in Afghanistan say torture has ended, the prisoners in Gitmo say torture has ended, not one single piece of evidence like an Abu Ghraib picture has been leaked portraying torture, BUT "there's no way of knowing torture has ended."

        By that insane logic, there's no way of knowing that Obama isn't kidnapping the first born infant of every couple with green eyes and brown eyes and cutting out its heart and eating it.  For that matter, there's no way of knowing that Dennis Kuchifrito isn't doing such a thing either.

        In other words, you are saying you are not part of the reality based, evidence based community.

        Carry on my friend.  If you want to believe torture is continuing despite all the evidence, feel free to do so.

        Just don't expect any of us rational people who are part of the reality based community to give a shit what you believe.

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