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View Diary: The Iraq Election: Defining Success (489 comments)

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  •  Oh, of course I agree with almost all points you (none)
    made, but on the following note I am not that pessimistic.

    "Can Democracy really take root in a country that has faced such atrocities just because one of the perpetrators of some of these atrocies says to have an election?  What about the real underlying basic problems between the religious groups in this country.  Just what have we done to realistically try and deal with these root causes.  Name me one thing?"

    No, I can't name and don't want to name one thing. There is not one thing I could name.

    But I don't think it is "our" problems to try and deal with the root problems of Iraq, as long as they are related to ethnic or religious conflicts among Iraqi population groups or caused through imperial policies decades ago. We can't change anything about that today.

    I am very sure that the Iraqi want to solve their root problems by themselves first, before they want them to get resolved by others. If their root problems were caused by (imperialist) economic reasons related to global trade and global "corporate fascism" (uuh, I can't believe I took over this expression), it would be different. But hey, I don't know everything about their "root problems" and what they perceive their "root problems" is not clear to me at all.

    But the reaction of the Iraqi wanting to build their democratic system by themselves is a basic human reaction of people everywhere in the world. Have you ever seen any country, which didn't want "the Ami" to leave? Because they felt "ashamed" for "needing help" from the Americans and because they felt ripped off their "dignity" and appalled that the US "intervened in their national affairs"? I think it would be nice, if the Americans could not only understand those reactions, but also would respect them more.

    And what you say about the Iraqi mothers, who have lost kids and family members due to the US war invasion, think about all the German mothers after WWII. Don't you think they could have "hated the Americans, because they killed their sons, who were soldiers in WWII"?

    Well, it didn't happen. I haven't heard much about "hating the Americans" after WWII, because they have killed thousands of German mother's sons during the war. I have heard much more about "hating Americans" because of their "cultural and economical imperialism" (hmm, I don't know if this is the right term) in our times than I heard about hating American for being defeated and killed during the atrocities of combat warfare.

    There is a conscience about who has the true moral justification to fight in a war among the population. Even if that is never expressed openly, people know, who has good intentions and who has not. It was absolutely clear for Germans to accept that the deaths caused by Americans killing their sons in combat, were unavoidable, considering that the Germans were the first aggressors, oppressors and mass murderers.  

    And I am pretty sure, an Iraqi mother makes similar comparisons, and my hope is that in the end they find the American troops less "murderous" than the "insurgent troops" or "Saddam's Bathist henchmen". They know who had more humane and civil intentions. So, even if their sons might have been caught in the middle of the mess and got killed, you don't start hating the Americans automatically. Now, let's say, I hope that being the case, but I really don't know it.

    For example the Russians were not hated by the Germans for the deaths they caused in combat against the German soldiers, they were hated because they raped women after victory and destroyed senselessly property after having defeated the Germans.

    So, don't worry about Iraqi mothers hating Americans for a long time. I doubt it somehow.  The  more of a calm reconstruction of the country is going on and the earlier that happens the less they are hated.

    Actually I think the solution would be to really have international troops to help the Iraqi to fight their terrorists, if they needed and wanted it.

    It would be time for Europeans and the UN to show some teeth and get involved.

    Though Bush hasn't deserved to be helped. But that might not really be of any relevance.

    Human life should be governed by truth, freedom, justice and love.

    by mimi on Sun Jan 30, 2005 at 03:39:23 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

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