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View Diary: U.S. Encouraged by Vietnam Vote (NYT 9/4/1967) (274 comments)

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  •  Shia Arabs (none)
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/featherstone/featherstone21.html

    Here's an interesting read about an event with Prof. Juan Cole where his main point is that Shia Arabs (who will be the majority rules in Iraq) have never run ANYTHING.

    "Cole's main point - something that bears emphasizing and something I was thinking of writing about on my own last week - is that a Shia-run government is truly a revolutionary state of affairs in the mashreq (the eastern part of the Arab world). Shia Arabs have never ever run anything, not in the 500 some-odd year of official Twelver Shiism following its adoption as the official religion of Safavid Persia."

    •  No, you're right (none)
      neither had black folks in the US, prior to the voting rights act.

      I'm not sure what your point is.  I hope it's not that the fact that Shia's have been excluded from political power for 500 years means we should continue to exclude them.  That would be a horrible point of view, not worthy of this blog.

      •  More akin to Reconstruction (none)
        Genuine Shia rule would be a much more radical development than the post-Voting Rights Act election of Black mayors and more akin to the Radical Reconstruction legislatures of South Carolina and Lousiana. But we should be very careful about assuming that the U.S. will allow any such thing since the Shia masses are not likely to be any keener on seeing Iraqs oil wealth pumped into the accounts of U.S. oil companies than the Sunnis or the Kurds. Sadly I think the odds are better that this election will be remembered as the Vietnamese show elections were.

        "Tell no lies. Claim no easy victories." -- Amilcar Cabral

        by Christopher Day on Mon Jan 31, 2005 at 09:41:46 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Oy (none)
        What a comparison.

        Do you think people on this blog shouldn't pay any attention to Prof. Juan Cole?  

        Maybe you don't realize it but you're taking the same "you're either with us or you're against us" attitude as Bush.  

        There are 2 kinds of people:  People who think there are 2 kinds of people and people who think its a little more complicated.

        •  Oy, what a reduction to absurdity (none)
          Do I think people shouldn't read Juan Cole?  
          I don't think that.  

          Do you think that the fact that Shiites "have never run anything" is a reason to exclude them from running anything?  It certainly would make decisions on government much easier.  You could do away with elections.

          But I don't think that. I think that the Voting Rights Act has been an amazing success.  I think that bringing the Shia into government is likely to succeed.  I'm not at all alarmed at the replacement of a corrupt class of governing people which depended on a vicious intelligence service to keep itself in power with a group of people who are not quite amateurs, because many of them are the ones who have been mayors and deputy mayors and governors for the last 18 months.

          •  Huh? (none)
            I thought that the comparison with voting rights in the US was an effort to make an argument out of something I'm not arguing about.

            My take on Juan Cole's point about the Shia-Arabs never having run anything is that the fact they will now be running Iraq is a wild card.  

            We're told (by the government and the TV media) that we should be happy and proud about these elections but who in their right mind would bet anything of value that even just ten years whatever situation in Iraq that will be seen as the inevitable result of these elections is something we'll be happy and proud about?  

            America will be responsible for that situation 10 years down the road.

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