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View Diary: What about the pay ethic? (294 comments)

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  •  There was only one reason I looked for a BS (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    cdreid, kurt, DruidQueen, The Lone Apple

    when hiring computer programmers.

    It told me you would put up with 4 years
    of horse hockey so you would most likely
    put up with me.

    George Bush is Living proof of the axiom "Never send a boy to do a man's job" E -2.25 S -4.10

    by nathguy on Mon Nov 01, 2010 at 08:31:36 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  I have a BS in Comp Sci (4+ / 0-)

      I must throw a flag on the field here...

      If you invested 4 or 5 years of your life in a comp sci degree and didn't learn about the fundamentals and history of the discipline sufficient to do the job and know how and why to do it well, you went to the wrong school or shouldn't be in the field.

      Are there morons with comp sci BS?  Sure... that's about diploma mills, poor standards, and social promotion.

      I know three people who are outstanding and self taught in the field without a formal education.  I've been in the field for 30 years and all the other (hundreds) of leaders and outstanding practitioners I know have degrees, not because it makes it easier for HR to screen resumes, but because they needed the education to put depth on their experience and help them communicate with other specialists.  

      Computer science is an engineering degree.  Programming is a craft.  You can learn the craft on your own, or more likely at the feet of a master - but learning the engineering part requires more of an investment in education (in school or other) that is NOT wasted effort, if you intend to do engineering.

      •  It used to be (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Odysseus, kurt, The Lone Apple

        It isnt anymore. And unfortunately whats left of the field will finally move to india en toto soon.

        The paradigm (I know i hate the word too) was shifted by MS from quality coding to dumbed down systems.. RAD, Java etc to the point that only a tiny micropercentage do real coding. The rest manipulate the building blocks of clunky RAD systems to build even high end graphics apps. Not that RAD isnt great for some things. Its a fantastic way to make quick easy tools or small apps.

        In addition you have the outsourcing factor. 6 billion people out there most of whom , even with much more advanced degrees, make pocket change. I have an african friend with a masters who doesnt dare dream of the american minimum wage.

        Sadly your dream field and mine is going the way of the machinist and civil engineer.

        I think the entitled degreed class is going to spend the next 20 years experiencing the horror their votes inflicted on the nondegreed worker. And i cant say i feel much empathy. (This from someone who started programming 30 years ago as well).

        And Jesus said to his disciples, "Truly, I say to you, it will be hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.

        by cdreid on Mon Nov 01, 2010 at 10:19:47 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Didn't sat bs cs (0+ / 0-)

        I was looking for a general bs or ba

        George Bush is Living proof of the axiom "Never send a boy to do a man's job" E -2.25 S -4.10

        by nathguy on Tue Nov 02, 2010 at 07:55:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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