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View Diary: Extra! Extra! Read the word that wins the tax cut debate! (288 comments)

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  •  Step by step (16+ / 0-)

    Getting the top tax rate to 39.6% is a start.  I agree that it ultimately needs to be higher for the very wealthy -- but if we can't even return it to 39.6%, then we're not going to get 45%, 50%, or higher...

    Political Compass: -6.75, -3.08

    by TexasTom on Fri Nov 26, 2010 at 09:32:48 PM PST

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    •  but if we cant even talk about it (6+ / 0-)

      if you ask a repub for 39.6 they'll give 37. Just start asking for the 70%,  At this point 39 doesnt do crap for the economy or working families.

      FDR and LBJ didnt ask for a penny when they needed a dollar, they hammered shit thru with a vengeance.

      Just what does 39.6% get us? Realistically, with U6 in the high teens, GDP hovering between 1.8 and 2.2%, just what do you expect to accomplish with 39,6%?

      Stop negotiating, fight for what you know is right. We're on the verge of sliding into another depression. Hell even Bernanke is shitting bricks, calling for massive job stim, calling unemployment the biggest risk to the economy.

      FDR 9-23-33, "If we cannot do this one way, we will do it another way. But do it we will.

      by Roger Fox on Fri Nov 26, 2010 at 09:50:09 PM PST

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      •  At this point in time... (4+ / 0-)

        ...if you ask for a 70% marginal tax rate on the rich, you'll get dismissed as a nut, and won't even be part of the debate.

        Considering that 70% was the top rate just 30 years ago, that tells me how far to the right the "overton window" has moved when it comes to taxes.  While there is merit in asking for more than you expect to receive, it still has to be something that is considered generally reasonable in the current climate.

        Reagan knew this when he pushed for his tax changes.  When he took office, the top rate was 70%.  When he left office, it was 28%.  But he didn't try for 28% in 1981 -- he shot for 50%, and got it.  Once he had that, he tried again and got 28%.  But if he had suggested 28% in 1981, his tax proposals would have been DOA.

        Meanwhile, the current debate is framed by the fact that inaction will give us a tax rate of 39.6% -- which means that really is the default for the current discussion.  

        Once that is done, I'd love to see a push for some additional brackets -- I'd push for 50% on millionaires, with the expectation of getting 45%.  Then for 60% on multimillionaires, with the expectation of getting 50 or 55%.  And so on...  Eventually, 70% could be within the "overton window" again...but we're not there right now.

        Political Compass: -6.75, -3.08

        by TexasTom on Sat Nov 27, 2010 at 09:11:40 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Oh, and I'd pitch the reason for the increase... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          goheelsgodems, Seneca Doane

 debt reduction.  That way, the "serious" people would either have to take it seriously, or else explain why they think that the pain of debt reduction should only fall on the poor and middle class.

          Political Compass: -6.75, -3.08

          by TexasTom on Sat Nov 27, 2010 at 09:12:40 AM PST

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        •  The biggest tax raise in 1983 (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Seneca Doane

          after the biggest cut in 1982. Reagan's crew did the most radical restructuring of the tax code to put most of the burden on the lower 95%.

          The AMT was designed to hit the top 400 or so families that were paying essentially 0 taxes. After Reagan it started settling on a lower and ever lower percentile of tax payers.

          He cut deductions that helped the middle income earners such as the deduction for sales taxes and for interest on other things besides houses. The rich don't pay interest on credit cards; they pay them off each month. The rest of us have to run a balance at least at times of unexpected emergencies.

          There were a lot of other changes like that.

          I'm asking you to believe. Not in my ability to bring about real change in Washington ... I'm asking you to believe in yours. Barack Obama

          by samddobermann on Sun Nov 28, 2010 at 11:13:48 AM PST

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    •  I suspect (5+ / 0-)

      that had the conversation started with:

      "We are going to extend the tax cuts for the middle classes, and raise the tax rate to 50% for the rich",

      Then we would have already got the extension for the middle class and the 39% by now.

      We do not forgive our candidates their humanity, therefore we compel them to appear inhuman

      by twigg on Fri Nov 26, 2010 at 10:07:30 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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