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View Diary: Some thoughts on liberal voices and ex-Republicans (141 comments)

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  •  I deeply wish it wasn't. :( (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    KayCeSF, Driver 8

    "I get up, I walk, I fall down. Meanwhile, I keep dancing." Daniel Hillel

    by Onomastic on Wed Dec 01, 2010 at 09:30:16 PM PST

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    •  So do I. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Onomastic, Driver 8

      It's making me feel ill.  Literally.

      •  I'm with you Kay. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        KayCeSF, Driver 8

        It's all Swiftian all the time now.

        "I get up, I walk, I fall down. Meanwhile, I keep dancing." Daniel Hillel

        by Onomastic on Wed Dec 01, 2010 at 10:03:57 PM PST

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        •  Negativism attracts negativism. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Onomastic, gobears2000, Driver 8

          They all feed on it.  

          •  Was just thinking that. (4+ / 0-)

            It's so unhealthy. Toxic.

            I get reasoned criticism. I'm not too happy with the "messaging" or lack there of right now. I'd like to see more call outs of Republican BS behavior. Though I'm really enjoying folks like Stockman, the Military Brass and others calling out the GOP's BS.

            I've always thought that letting the GOP condemn themselves out of their own mouths made sense. On the other hand at some point you have to remind people just what the GOP is doing.

            That said, I don't get blanket negativity.

            There's a huge distinction between that and a reasoned critique, usually due to lack of facts or inability to recognize limitations.

            I'm not a huge fan of the all or nothing mind set.

            It usually results in just the latter.  

            "I get up, I walk, I fall down. Meanwhile, I keep dancing." Daniel Hillel

            by Onomastic on Wed Dec 01, 2010 at 11:05:29 PM PST

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            •  "all or nothing" (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              KayCeSF, Onomastic

              It usually results in just the latter.  

              "but a good time was had by all"

              /snark

              "Show up. Pay attention. Tell the truth. And don't be attached to the results." -- Angeles Arrien

              by Sybil Liberty on Thu Dec 02, 2010 at 07:25:30 AM PST

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            •  Back here to reread diary with morning coffee, (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Onomastic, Driver 8

              and reading your comment you say:

              On the other hand at some point you have to remind people just what the GOP is doing.

              I'm thinking, at some point it seems that we also need to remind people here just what the GOP has been doing for decades.  Often, so often I believe people have somehow forgotten or don't know their history.  

              The diarist certainly evidences by his own words that Markos believes he understood the Republicans to be different when he was one, the word "was" being a passive-aggressive word in this case which transfers forward and explains the present difficulty for discussing politics in the present with these past-Republican now-Democrat professional pundits?  I knew they had been Republicans,  I just never connected the dots as Driver 8 has done with this thoughtful, intelligent diary.

              I'm not a fan of all or nothing either.  But then, the Republicans are going for all, or they will give our President Nothing!  "Hell No, you can't!"  period.

              This diary is a keeper!

              I hope I made sense.  I need more coffee.  ,)

              •  ((((((((Kay))))))) (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                KayCeSF, Driver 8

                Of course it made sense.

                Agree about the diary's opening up the discussion to how perceptions are carried through from one situation to another and affect how those situations are perceived.  

                Not sure I said that clearly, but then all the coffee in the world isn't going to help me much today.

                Agree with you too as to the lack of historical framework.

                This is all reminding me of what happened after 9/11 with the country's emotional response.

                Far too many of "us" -  the American people, pundits and politicos - allowed fear and uncertainty to occlude our ability to respond in a thoughtful, reasonable manner. That set "us" up for the manipulation that came out of the Bush Administration, aided and abetted by MSM.

                Unfortunately, it feels like we're replaying that emotional response.  

                "I get up, I walk, I fall down. Meanwhile, I keep dancing." Daniel Hillel

                by Onomastic on Thu Dec 02, 2010 at 08:29:59 AM PST

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              •  Thank you so much! (4+ / 0-)

                Your comment made me smile.

                I do think that many ex-Republicans have succeeded in convincing a whole lot of younger folks that the Republican Party used to be different, somehow.  Sane and moderate and reasonable.

                While it is true that at one point there were more individual Republicans who were moderate (mostly in the Northeast), the party as a whole has had the goal of reducing government and freeing up money for the wealthy and powerful for as long as I can see.  

                Henry Hyde was no moderate.  Kos believed in him enough as a young man to help organize his campaign. That means he once believed that world-view.  

                None of this "But they were different then!" nonsense, that is demonstrably untrue.

                •  Thank you, Driver! (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Onomastic, FiredUpInCA

                  You give food for thought.  I've been thinking about so much you talked about, especially the fact that so many with the loud voices either were or are Republicans (maybe some Dixie-crats, Naderites, Hillary or Edwards supporters) and how it has influenced their aggressive approach to politics.  I'm unable to get down on their level in conversations here.  It's exhausting to try to have a reasonable and intelligent conversation when one is being called names.  The issues are rarely really discussed, it's more a game of name-calling and games of intimidation.

                  Well... nothing I say adds to your wonderful diary.  But it was such a good read last night and this morning.  Thank you ever so much.  Good work!

                •  Seconding what Kay said Driver 8. (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Driver 8, FiredUpInCA

                  It's not often that we're invited to a thought provoking discussion.

                  Appreciate it. :)

                  "I get up, I walk, I fall down. Meanwhile, I keep dancing." Daniel Hillel

                  by Onomastic on Thu Dec 02, 2010 at 12:47:43 PM PST

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                •  Oh, I get it. (0+ / 0-)

                  In some ways, there's a thin line between Republicans and Libertarians.

                  More food for thought.

                  Thanks

                  "I get up, I walk, I fall down. Meanwhile, I keep dancing." Daniel Hillel

                  by Onomastic on Thu Dec 02, 2010 at 04:41:03 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

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