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View Diary: Tax deal still in doubt. So are the parties to the deal. (317 comments)

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  •  Not really no (2+ / 0-)
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    Geekesque, kat68

    I think Obama is doing what he thinks is the best he can with the shitty hand he's been dealt. I disagree with him. Often. Often and Strongly. But it was Obama who had been pushing for doing away with the Bush tax cuts all along and trying to get Congress to do their job. It was Congress... the Senate specifically... that failed. Now Obama is going to plan b. I dislike plan b but it is not his fault we are in this position.

    It's the Republicans fault.

    The Republicans and a 58 seat Senate majority that can't get anything passed unless the 42 seat minority approves of it.

    "Do what you can with what you have where you are." - Teddy Roosevelt

    by Andrew C White on Wed Dec 08, 2010 at 07:39:07 PM PST

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    •  One little word-VETO (4+ / 0-)
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      cdreid, ravenwind, aliasalias, PZinOR

      Had he let Congress know he would veto any extension for the top tier we would'nt even be here.  It's not hard to get rid of the Bush tax cuts...just let them go quietly into that good night.

      •  Veto has nothing to do with it (1+ / 0-)
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        just don't pass them. Which Congress didn't. They go away. That problem is solved.

        What he thinks he is trying to do is get the other parts of the deal passed. Like Unemployment Insurance and the baseline tax cuts for all of us... which also go away because they didn't get passed.

        This isn't solely about the extra tax cuts for the filthy rich. If it was then it would be easy. But it isn't so it is not easy.

        "Do what you can with what you have where you are." - Teddy Roosevelt

        by Andrew C White on Wed Dec 08, 2010 at 08:35:35 PM PST

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        •  We differ then... (0+ / 0-)

          I oppose all the tax cuts.  The only one really worth keeping is the Child Tax Credit.  People who are fortunate enough to have work like myself should be glad to pay a little extra to help those who do not (unemployed) or cannot (disabled, elderly).

          •  Timing matters with tax cuts (0+ / 0-)

            In general I think we all pay too low taxes. If the economy was going along strongly then I would say let all the cuts expire and let tax rates go back closer to a reasonable level. In fact I think at the very least high end tax rates need to go up beyond what the expiration would do. We are essentially at all time low tax rates right now and that is a serious problem.

            But timing matters. It is true that raising taxes on people during a recession is a bad idea. It closes down buying power which lowers demand which causes further job loss and more recession. So now is not the time to let the so-called middle class tax cut expire. The high end tax cuts that affect only 2% of the population can be safely allowed to expire with no negative effect towards the economy whatsoever. Their tax cuts don't get spent. The tax cuts for the other 98% of us do. Therefore tax cuts for the lower 98% are good for the economy and tax cuts for the upper 2% are bad for the economy.

            Once the economy is going strong I would argue in favor of raising taxes on all of us (carefully) and using the money to pay down the debt (which should absolutely NOT be done now) and fund other domestic programs. Paying down the debt now, like insisting on pay-go, is as bad for the economy as raising taxes. Such things are also time dependent. When the economy is going strong, raise taxes and pay down the debt and work to balance the budget. When the economy is in a recession/depression keep taxes low or lower them and increase spending... through debt if necessary (which is almost always is)... in order to stimulate the economy and get it going strong again.

            These things go in cycles and the timing of each move is important. The Republicans ignore that in their tax cut, tax cut, tax cut mantra. Bush's tax cuts were the absolutely wrong thing at the wrong time. But right now is not the time to raise taxes on the lower 98% of us.

            "Do what you can with what you have where you are." - Teddy Roosevelt

            by Andrew C White on Thu Dec 09, 2010 at 09:38:44 AM PST

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