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View Diary: I apologize Mr. President (329 comments)

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  •  Jesus H Christ (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    regster, cuphalffull

    If you were given a solid gold ingot, you'd seemingly bitch that it wasn't diamond-encrusted.

    ... and we have seen the black suns | pouring forth the night. -- Clark Ashton Smith

    by bustacap on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 04:17:57 PM PST

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    •  Project much? (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      musing85, teknofyl, Empty Vessel

      I said the strategy was good. But nope. That's not good enough for you. I must kiss the ring or you'll swear at me. Why is it such a crime to not be in love with Obama here?

      The timing was awful. Because the Hail Mary Pass worked does not mean it was a good idea to count on it.

      Now passing 1,000 Choi Units into the Obama administration.

      by Scott Wooledge on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 04:29:59 PM PST

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      •  I do find this (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        musing85, teknofyl, Clarknt67

        aspect of some diehard Obama supporters nerve wrecking...this whole "kiss the ring" bullshit.

        And I am a tepid Obama supporter.

      •  Yeah, it was a gamble. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bustacap

        And it paid off.  Like you said, I don't think it was the surest, best strategy... your Hail Mary analogy is pretty good some of the last minute shit was straight up heroic, certainly the last minute split into a stand alone bill was not part of the long term strategy.

        Give Obama credit for creating the atmosphere going into the lame duck session. Credit for the actual navigation of the bill through Congress properly goes to Congressional Democrats and activists, with the umph of the final push coming from activists, Congressional Dems and the Obama administration with a key part of the consensus being military brass buy-in (which I think you can credit Obama for that - the commission's output I think really delivered the broad top-level buy-in. I did not expect to happen as a result of that commission, I though it was a bullshit move by Obama. But, it fit into his plans how he thought it would so you have to give him a check on planning and execution for that phase of the process).

        So yeah.  I'm surprised and delighted that repeal is through, though.  Major civil rights stuff right there.

        Obama - getting rolled like a chump by mouth-breathers since 2008.

        by teknofyl on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 06:28:53 PM PST

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        •  Well, I give credit the military buy in worked (4+ / 0-)

          from getting Gates, Mullen and ultimately the survey was a plus. And that's what I meant by good strategy.  But it was poorly timed, and I got slammed for making that observation. Gates said in May, "Don't vote until the survey's done!" So we had to wait until lame duck. But even neophyte politicos know, lame duck is a time when the losing party has little leverage and little time. So the failed votes, the hail Mary, all unnecessary stress and strive.

          And a lost opportunity, if we believe Rachel Maddow who said "the base will reward him."

          Wouldn't it have been nice to have put the base in that mood going into midterms?

          Now passing 1,000 Choi Units into the Obama administration.

          by Scott Wooledge on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 07:38:56 PM PST

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          •  Yes, I agree the timing was not good at all. (0+ / 0-)

            DADT was something that could have inspired turnout in November.  I'm not sure that the GOP votes would have been there prior to the election... the TP seems to have them on a very, very short leash.

            That was not a good reason not to try, because if you are only looking for a few votes you never know what will happen.

            But it passed.  That's good.

            Obama - getting rolled like a chump by mouth-breathers since 2008.

            by teknofyl on Tue Dec 21, 2010 at 04:37:40 AM PST

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      •  Bottom line (0+ / 0-)

        The plan worked; perhaps not to your complete and utter satisfaction, but it worked.  This is politics.  This is how things get done.

        If DADT had been ended by the fiat of executive order without the seemingly interminable steps than have preceded this, it could just as easily have be reinstituted in the future with exactly the same mechanism in the name of "protecting the unity and esprit de corp of our armed forces" or some other such inane drivel.

        And this is, face it, a leap in the right direction that is going to be difficult to overturn.

        And it's not a "crime to not be in love with Obama here."  In fact I -- who has visited here at least once almost ever single day since I joined back over six years ago -- have actively avoided this place for weeks because of near-constant deluge of depressing, enthusiasm-sapping back-biting and negativity.

        ... and we have seen the black suns | pouring forth the night. -- Clark Ashton Smith

        by bustacap on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 06:57:31 PM PST

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        •  The thing of it is, (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          teknofyl

          it isn't about my dissatisfaction. It appears, the strategy of attaching it to the NDAA made the NDAA a the sacrificial lamb, after it got voted down twice.

          Vet groups are rightfully very upset. There were pay raises, new programs to address PTSD, sexual assault, and a bunch of other things, that will have to wait. Or, because of Speaker Boehner, will now be lost forever.

          So the bottom line isn't quite as simple. DADT did get repealed, but the plan definitely came at a cost. Gay troops won, but all troops suffered.

          Now passing 1,000 Choi Units into the Obama administration.

          by Scott Wooledge on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 07:30:19 PM PST

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        •  It can still be reinstituted. (0+ / 0-)

          I really wish people would read this statute.  There's nothing in it that protects LGB servicemembers from dismissal based on sexual orientation.  There's nothing in it that guarantees LGB servicemembers the right to serve openly, or even to serve at all.

          Instead, the statute gives the Pentagon unfettered discretion to make policy in this area.  Assuming that all of the certifications are made, and that 10 U.S.C. § 654 is finally actually repealed, any future administration will have the power to reinstitute DADT or an even harsher policy if it so chooses.  The administration and Congress made a deliberate decision NOT to include nondiscrimination guarantees in the statute.  

          Maladie d'Amour, Où l'on meurt d'Aimer, Seul et sans Amour, Sid'abandonné

          by FogCityJohn on Mon Dec 20, 2010 at 08:38:32 PM PST

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