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View Diary: Thwarting Gun Violence (104 comments)

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  •  In the recent Tucson case (4+ / 0-)

    it seems to me that the Pima College campus police dropped the ball. The shooter had been expelled from the college for disruptive behavior, two campus cops visited the house to notify the family.
    Why did these cops not put a red flag in the BATF database ?

    When a President goin' through the White House door does what he says he'll do, we'll all be drinkin' that free Bubble-Up and eatin' that Rainbow Stew - Merle

    by Azazello on Mon Jan 24, 2011 at 07:32:40 AM PST

    •  Should we put people on a no-buy list (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      KVoimakas

      because they've been disruptive in an educational setting?

      •  In this case, yes. (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        BlackSheep1, KenBee, KVoimakas, SoCalSal

        This was not just a case of talking out of turn in class, he was banned from the campus and the police were involved.

        When a President goin' through the White House door does what he says he'll do, we'll all be drinkin' that free Bubble-Up and eatin' that Rainbow Stew - Merle

        by Azazello on Mon Jan 24, 2011 at 07:43:50 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  That's the problem, of course. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        BlackSheep1, meagert, KenBee

        All of these arguments eventually devolve into discussions of who can and cannot buy guns.  And we're just not any good at that.

        The No-Fly List kept by TSA is easy to get on, and impossible to get off of.  It's another manifestation of the East German Stasi's take on "citizen involvement".

        A No-Buy list for guns would be no different, either in design or implementation.

        We're simply not politically mature enough to promote that kind of granularity in our laws.

        Stranded Wind makes a fine case for education, and I agree with that.  It should be required, and a part of public education curricula.

        It ain't called paranoia - when they're really out to get you. 6 points.

        by Jaime Frontero on Mon Jan 24, 2011 at 09:03:15 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Compared to what? (0+ / 0-)

          OK, suppose we instituted a "no-gun-buy" list like the no-fly list. Suppose it had the same kind and quantity of problems.

          Sure, that would be bad, but would it be worse than the status quo? Because the status quo is pretty damn bad. See my other comment on this diary for a link re: how bad.

          I think the status quo is bad enough that we should try something different for awhile. Like taking realistic steps to prevent paranoid schizophrenics from buying guns.

          "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

          by HeyMikey on Mon Jan 24, 2011 at 12:04:32 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  So, you don't mind abusing the innocents... (0+ / 0-)

            so as to put no enforceable restrictions on actual criminals.

            Sorry, that's not how we do things here.

            •  Flown on a plane lately? (0+ / 0-)

              I think airport security has gone overboard. But nobody would argue we shouldn't have any airport security, or only security that doesn't inconvenience anybody in the least.

              Odds are that if you get on the no-gun-buy list by mistake, you can eventually get yourself off the list; so it's only a delay in acquiring a gun, not a permanent ban. Sure, it might be a hassle. But odds are you already own at least one gun anyway, so it's not like you'd be prevented from defending yourself. And if you don't have a gun at all, you probably know somebody who will loan you one until you get your name off the list.

              Seems like a reasonable price to pay for keeping guns away from the Loughners and Hinckleys and Seung-Hui Chos of the world.

              "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

              by HeyMikey on Tue Jan 25, 2011 at 07:45:14 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Sorry, it's the obligation of the government (0+ / 0-)

                to actually prove guilt, not the obligation of the Citizen to prove innocence.

                Again, you don't seem to understand how the system is supposed to function.

                Better a hundred guilty men go free.. etc.

                P.S.  I think the only worthwhile "airport security" is checking luggage and people for bombs.  Other than that, all Civil Rights should be in effect on planes, subject to the rules of the airline (private property, etc.), with the caveat that if they restrict my right to protect myself, they must offer some guarantee or compensation in return.

    •  Because they are not mental health professionals. (0+ / 0-)

      or a court justice.

      That's not how the procedure goes.

      There are countries where the police can do things like that.  I've been to some of them.  I really don't think you would want to be aything but a short-term tourist in any of them.

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