Skip to main content

View Diary: Finally...Prez Obama's Clear Statement on Egypt (213 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  yes nt (5+ / 0-)

    "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

    by grannyhelen on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 05:58:44 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  I haven't been dissatisfied (33+ / 0-)

      with the public stance on this from the Administration. I'm rec'ing this diary for the questions you raise which are damn good ones. And because it's you, granny. :)

      Count me in the "hands fucking off" category. We have a history in this country of getting overly involved in other sovereign nations essential business and I get the distinct impression that Obama and his administration are working overtime, diplomatically and behind the scenes to get Mubarak to step down.

      Mubarak put out his own less than subtle threat that other entities should "stay out of our effing business." I read that as him referring to the US and I have the feeling the protesters couldn't be more thrilled to hear him say that, because it just reinforces how badly we want Mubarak gone and now they have their own President basically admitting it.

      They're like the Inspector Clouseaus' of the blogging world.

      by Pager on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 06:10:15 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  It is not often that you and I disagree (6+ / 0-)

      in fact I don't think we ever have, but in this we do.

      Has the administration been thoroughly consistent from day one. No. Has it been driven by facts on the ground as opposed to driving those facts? Yes. And good luck to anyone who thinks that he or she could do better in this diplomatic and moral morass,

      In the choice between changing ones mind and proving there's no need to do so, most people get busy on the proof.

      by jsfox on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 06:26:21 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  This isn't a question of "can someone do better" (8+ / 0-)

        this is a question of "can something better be done and what is it".

        I feel that this is constructive criticism...but it is, still, criticism.

        "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

        by grannyhelen on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 06:28:37 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Again we disagree (7+ / 0-)

          What appears you wanted was for Obama to dive in head first right off the bat. not possible or prudent. You wanted him to throw the full weight of the US behind the protesters immediately before even knowing where this was heading. This would have been ill advised and a diplomatic blunder of a rather large magnitude.

          In the choice between changing ones mind and proving there's no need to do so, most people get busy on the proof.

          by jsfox on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 06:39:18 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  No - what I wanted him to do was to work w (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            lotlizard, gooderservice, JVolvo

            international partners to clear a path for the protesters to act in a free and unrestricted manner - that has been attempted, and I'd say it's about 80% successful (good, but certainly not good enough when we're talking about the lives of real people).

            What he has done well:

            1. Stopped Israel from freaking out and moving troops to the border.
            1. Helped to stop a lot of other US-friendly govts in the region from freaking out and doing any number of bad things that would destabilize the region.
            1. Halted a worldwide freakout in international markets.

            Those are all good things, and I do not short change them.

            That being said, other things can be done that would make this better...this is my constructive criticism about what those things are, and how they've fallen short in the past few weeks.

            "The revolution's just an ethical haircut away..." Billy Bragg

            by grannyhelen on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 06:48:05 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  agreed, but with the caveat that (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Debby, grannyhelen, foufou, worldlotus

            as someone who knows plenty of diplomats just because we all talk to each other in these foreign postings, I think we really need to understand that many of the most sensitive messages are given - very clearly - privately because a decision was made that private would be more effective.  

            I don't have any contacts working on Egypt, but I would be shocked if there weren't cables and phone calls flowing hourly almost since this started, not only with the Egyptian authorities, but also with other countries, including Israel.  Sometimes you look for subtle shifts in language particularly in official statements.  Sometimes you look for where there is sudden silence.  (Has Israel said much lately, for instance?  Maybe - I haven't been following that side of the story that closely.)  A lot more has to do with things said privately than we often recognize, and that may make it harder for us to praise or blame or even fully understand what's happening.  And, that can lead to it being all too easy to interpret the official statements through our own lens of what we think about this Administration, rightly or wrongly.

            (Sadly, in Kathmandu no longer.)

            by American in Kathmandu on Thu Feb 10, 2011 at 08:14:05 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

      •  Please. (0+ / 0-)

        If you think supporting a known torturer is the best the US can do, then you and I have very different definitions of "best."

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site