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View Diary: Egypt & Region Liveblog: Sub-Diary #105 (310 comments)

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  •  Hello, and thank you, conchita (6+ / 0-)

    for all you've done previously and to get us through the transition.

    It's hard to believe, but as an Arkansan I've followed her a bit so it wasn't as hard for me. Hillary and Wisner took Obama by surprise. Since there's a lot going on, so here's the relevant snip:

    WASHINGTON — Last Saturday afternoon, President Obama got a jarring update from his national security team: With restive crowds of young Egyptians demanding President Hosni Mubarak’s immediate resignation, Frank G. Wisner, Mr. Obama’s envoy to Cairo, had just told a Munich conference that Mr. Mubarak was indispensable to Egypt’s democratic transition.

    Mr. Obama was furious, and it did not help that his secretary of state, Hillary Rodham Clinton, Mr. Wisner’s key backer, was publicly warning that any credible transition would take time — even as Mr. Obama was demanding that change in Egypt begin right away.
    •  i saw this (4+ / 0-)

      i dunno, i just don't trust her, haven't since she became my senator in new york.  was wholeheartedly behind her till she took office and it became clear she had her own agenda and cared little about what her constituents thought (outside of helping those effected by 9.11).  imo, she is a first class equivocator and i could never vote for her again in any office.

      Brothers & sisters of #Egypt, you have given the world the most precious gift: the belief that ultimately right will prevail. -Desmond Tutu

      by conchita on Sun Feb 13, 2011 at 02:13:05 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  If only DK4 allowed for multiple recs :~) n/t (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        cotterperson, conchita, poco, Aunt Martha

        Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time. (Terry Pratchett)

        by angry marmot on Sun Feb 13, 2011 at 02:23:03 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  I don't hate her, don't love her (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        I mean really, is Sen. Schumer that much less of an opportunist?

        Obama, I think, hired Clinton as damage control, that having her on the team would cause problems but not as many problems as having her sniping at him from the sidelines.

        I think this incident brings out into the open the fissures that exist between Clinton & Obama - but at least as of TODAY (who knows about tomorrow) the course of events have smoothed things out and Wisner's actions are just a bump in the road.

        •  The reason I don't buy the "fissures" (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          conchita, poco

          theory is that Obama has had two years to change US policy toward Egypt and did not do so.  That says to me that he, like Clinton, is more interested in "stability."  She called Mubarak a friend of the family and he called Mubarak a friend of the US, so really, what's the difference?

          •  I'm not trying to paint Obama as (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:

            a saint by any means.

            But in this specific instance - I think Obama was in the right.

            •  I know you're not, (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              conchita, poco

              and I apologize if I came off that way.  Perhaps I'm cynical (don't agree too quickly...:)) but I can't help but wonder how much of what that article discussed is "real" and how much is for public consumption.   After all, it's not like Obama's foreign policy toward Egypt began on January 25, 2011.

              •  When it comes to the corporate (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                conchita, poco

                media figuring out the truth to a great degree boils down to navigating the waters with our bullshit detector on at all times.

                What YOUR gut feeling says is BS may differ from what MY gut feeling says is BS, but that's just the way it goes.

                •  Absolutely. (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  conchita, bee tzu

                  But I think we also have to make sure that we distinguish between what people say and what people do.  And Obama has had two years to do something different from what he's done.  So while I agree with you that in this specific instance Obama was in the right, he had to be brought there by the Egyptian people.

          •  the only thing I would say (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            bee tzu, lompe

            is that he did have his hands more than full the last 2 years with the massive economic issues here at home, figuring out how to manage TARP and the big 3 auto companies, the BP disaster, the health care bill and Iran and N. Korea and of course Isreal and the two wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.  So I don't fault him or Sec Clinton for not having any time to focus on the country of Egypt.  

            •  Well, it's not like either of them reacted (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              conchita, poco, bee tzu, FORUS50

              differently to the situation in Honduras; they promoted "stability" over democracy there as well.  So, sure, there's been a lot going on, but that comes with the job.  And sure, he inherited a mess from GWB, but he's also made choices (e.g., the way he has escalated the AfPak war).

              I will say that his latest speech seemed different to me, in a good way, but I'll withhold judgment until I see what he does.  He's a great rhetorician, but I'm less than thrilled with some of his actions.

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