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View Diary: Instapundit Makes Stuff Up Too (184 comments)

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  •  It Churchill gets fired (4.00)
    it'll bother me a LOT.  

    Tenure (not to mention the First Amendment) was instituted to protect the right of professors to speak and publish their beliefs.  From the coverage I've seen on this, Churchill was trying to get his students to think critically about 9/11.  Yes, "little Eichmanns" was an awfully unfortunate way to do it.  But is it un-American to pose the question the we may have done something to provoke the 9/11 attacks?  

    If Churchill gets fired, the Right will have dealt a serious blow against the protections tenure provides.  It'll be a significant step toward censoring what profs can say in their classrooms.

    •  If his tenure protection is applicable (none)
      one would assume he won't be fired. That's what I meant by his legal recourse.

      "Just say no to torture." -Semi-Anonymous Blogger.

      by Armando on Wed Mar 02, 2005 at 12:40:59 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  *IF* his tenure protection is applicable?? (none)
        That's the problem, Armando--the fact the people see an "if" here.

        Both the President of UC Boulder and the Governor of Colorado obviously think Churchill's tenure (and free speech) protections are "iffy."  And that's bad news for all of us.

        •  Why is that a problem? (none)
          Either e was speaking in his academic role, in which case it, or he wasn't, in which case, it isn't.

          What's your problem with that?

          "Just say no to torture." -Semi-Anonymous Blogger.

          by Armando on Wed Mar 02, 2005 at 12:56:32 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I saw a TV interview (none)
            with the Governor of Colorado vs. Churchill's lawyer.  The Gov. was arguing out of both sides of his mouth: he claimed that yes, Churchill has the right to free speech BUT he should be fired.

            C's lawyer correctly pointed out that the right to free speech doesn't merely mean you can say whatever you want; it also means that you are protected from punishment (e.g. losing your job) resulting from what you say.

            You can't strip the 1st Amendment (or tenure protections) down to something like "you may say whatever you please, but do it while unemployed or in jail."  

            You're a lawyer, Armando.  Don't you see that as dangerous?

            •  Churchill's Lawyer (none)
              will take care of the legal arguments.  He doesn't need me for that.

              "Just say no to torture." -Semi-Anonymous Blogger.

              by Armando on Wed Mar 02, 2005 at 01:09:16 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  What about labels? (none)
                What about Dem's being...flip floppers, wishy washy, for free speech before they were against it.

                You seem worried about the 'America haters' label. But by leaving the Ward Churchill's of the world hung out to dry you ignore other 'label traps' they have waiting for you.

                An analogy that might apply...

                This is like people who think women have the right to 'choice' but aren't willing to stand up for doctors that perform abortions because the right labels them baby killers and you worry that by defending abortion providers the label might stick them.

                •  Can't one keep a distance from the statements (none)
                  without "hanging 'em out to dry"?
                  •  The statements are a red herring. (none)
                    If it was inflammatory, repugnant, and offensive language that was the crime Ward Churchill wouldn't be the only defendant.

                    What we are talking about is the right to free speech and dissent.

                    Do I have to distance myself from Anne Coulter's remarks about Arabs before I defend her right to speak?

                    Is it assumed that anybody defending Coulter's right to speak automatically agrees with the content of her speech?

                    If I agree with Churchill's content and agree with his right to say it do I hate America?

                    Do I hate some Americans?

                    Or do I have a very strong opinion regarding the complicity of some Americans in horrendous crimes?

                    Perhaps Hate plays no part in these opinions.

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