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View Diary: Republicans continue rich tradition of blaming their candidates (98 comments)

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  •  Pardon, but I have an objection (1+ / 0-)
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    SaoMagnifico

    The debate only happened among House Republicans internally, the Senate wasn't part of the calculus. Hell, Boehner handed Harry Reid the issue on a silver platter, and he smacked Senate Republicans upside the head with it.

    I don't get this awe that some liberals seem to have about how Republicans handle politics, they acted stupidly, they are worse off now than they were in a world where they didn't try to pass the Ryan budget, and they don't even have a policy victory to show for it.

    Meanwhile, the Democrats, for whatever flaws you can see with how they handled HCR, they did ultimately get it passed, they somehow got Ben Nelson and Bernie Sanders to stand together in support of the same bill, that could never have happened if Nancy Pelosi had tried to force all of her members to vote for a single-payer plan (and yes, it would only be Nancy Pelosi, because Harry Reid, as Senate Leader, simply doesn't have the same power that the Speaker of the House (or House Minority Leader) have over his own members).

    Politics and more Handle name DGM on Swing State Project

    by NMLib on Fri Jun 03, 2011 at 12:27:06 AM PDT

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    •  I reject your objection (1+ / 0-)
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      MichaelNY

      Democrats were unable to achieve a similar level of unity in the House. And were the Republicans in control of the Senate with a similar level of support, there is no reason to believe that they would have engaged in similar dickering.

      Ok, so I read the polls.

      by andgarden on Fri Jun 03, 2011 at 03:56:52 AM PDT

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      •  Oh, you mean like how the Republicans handled... (1+ / 0-)
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        MichaelNY

        SS privatization? Yeah, that was a sign of a real well-oiled Republican machine...

        And it's not like we don't already know that there weren't a whole lot of Republican House members now who are pissed about this whole situation.

        And really, the fact that Republicans had defections in the senate now when they only have 47 members betrays what you're saying, because unlike the House, McConnell has a lot less he can threaten his members with should they vote no.

        Politics and more Handle name DGM on Swing State Project

        by NMLib on Fri Jun 03, 2011 at 11:30:06 AM PDT

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        •  If the Republicans had gotten (1+ / 0-)
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          MichaelNY

          the kind of unity in the House for the SS privatization plan that they did for the Ryan Medicare plan, it could (and likely would) have easily been passed through the Senate, probably using reconciliation.

          Ok, so I read the polls.

          by andgarden on Fri Jun 03, 2011 at 11:39:45 AM PDT

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          •  I doubt it (1+ / 0-)
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            MichaelNY

            Fact remains, it's a lot easier to keep unanimity in the House than it is in the Senate, House rules and norms give the Speaker a lot more power over his/her members than the Senate majority leader. It's like I mentioned before, Boehner wasn't interested in getting it through the Senate, it was never part of the equation, it was used as a purity test, which is why you didn't see a lot of work put into the bill, it had no chance of becoming law.

            Bush, on the other hand, seriously intended to get SS privatization passed into law, the reason it never passed the House is because it could never have passed the Senate (McCain, Talent, Snowe, Collins, Martinez, Specter, Chafee, Lugar, Coleman, and Hagel were all either guaranteed no votes or were very likely to defect, Republicans only had 55 senators at the time, meaning they probably only had 45-46 solid votes, and even that may well be overstating things). I don't care what Tom DeLay had done back then, there were way too many Senators who opposed it, and Bill Frist had no way of coercing at least 50 members of his caucus to vote for it.

            It's impossible to keep intra-party disputes quiet when you start increasing the number of actors involved, that's why the SS privatization bill was such a fucking mess and why the Ryan bill passed the House with little drama, Boehner literally did not keep McConnell or Senate Republicans in the loop, he didn't have to give a damn about Snowe, or Collins, or Brown, or Kirk, or take your pick. And now Senate Republicans got to be in a bind over it.

            These House Republicans are idiots, and they paid a huge price for it, and they got absolutely nothing out of it.

            Politics and more Handle name DGM on Swing State Project

            by NMLib on Fri Jun 03, 2011 at 11:45:48 PM PDT

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