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View Diary: NYT Sunday FP Story: White House Spin Control On The Pfeiffer “Kerfuffle.” (A Teachable Moment.) (238 comments)

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  •  If You Don't Keep the Door Open (1+ / 0-)
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    missliberties
    I've had more than enough of those "demographics in the democratic party."

    If you want these demographics out of the Dem Party, then we'll never win another election of any consequence, certainly never the Presidency.  When will your ideals gain any ground again if that should happen?  

    •  The door is open and swings both ways (0+ / 0-)

      How many independents feel the same way I do?

      I'm about to become an independent myself.

      Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

      by Just Bob on Mon Jun 20, 2011 at 09:09:41 AM PDT

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      •  Independents (0+ / 0-)

        Aren't most independents the more centrist people in their parties that eventually go indpendent because they no longer feel wanted in their party, affectionately coined by the partisans the Blue Dogs and the RINOs?  

        •  That certainly has been the case in the past (0+ / 0-)

          and, to some extent, in the present. I don't think we have ever before been faced with the circumstances we face today.

          When both of the major parties have moved so far to the right that progressive values are not embraced or even welcome in either party, we're in uncharted territory.

          This sub-thread is an illustration of those circumstances.

          Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

          by Just Bob on Mon Jun 20, 2011 at 01:03:26 PM PDT

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          •  I Believe (0+ / 0-)

            that this President has accomplished much considering the house and senate that he had to work with.  He wasn't content to walk away with nothing so he's made compromises when necesary to at least give Progressive ideals a good start.  

            You said it your self above -- that both of the major parties have moved far to the right.  I don't think the Dem party has moved as far as you think they have, though and those that have, tend to represent moderate districts that could just as well go Republican.  I haven't counted, but it seems that a lot more of our Dem reps are moderate/centrist than that of the Republican party.  

            I admit I am a more moderate Democrat, but not of the Blue Dog variety.  I welcome Progressive ideals because they give us goals to work towards.  And, just maybe, if our party had the super majorities needed in both houses, we could make a lot more progress than has already been made.  The frustration for me, with some very leftist Dems is the lack of patience and the public thrashing this President receives from people in his very own party.  

            Holding one's feet to the fire is fair play, but the level of animosity displayed by many on the Professional Left is just going way too far.  

            •  I refuse to be held responsible for anything said (0+ / 0-)

              by others.

              As I said before, of the two major parties, the Republicans represent the right and the Democrats should represent the left. Yet we have had libertarian economic policy for over thirty years under both Republican and Democratic administrations. It's as if the DLC branch of the party is saying we will pursue progressive goals if Ayn Rand gets to run the economy and will give us the money to do so.

              BTW, the Progressive Caucus is the largest in Congress, yet the President refused to meet with them during the healthcare debate. That left a mark.

              Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

              by Just Bob on Mon Jun 20, 2011 at 07:29:23 PM PDT

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              •  I Sure Don't (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Just Bob

                hold you or anybody other than the people who bash the President responsible.

                Look, we are all trying to do the best we can working towards a set of ideals that will make this country a better place to live and to raise our kids.  

                We may have slightly different ways of getting there, but there is no doubt if we all work together, great things can be done.  When we are torn apart, the Republicans make progress and that's something we cannot afford to happen anymore!  

                You take care.  I have appreciated the back and forth conversation with you.  

                •  I'm in favor of working together, but (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  VickiL

                  let's not assume it should always be the progressive wing of the party that must give ground.

                  And yes, your perspective is appreciated as well. Take good care.

                  Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

                  by Just Bob on Tue Jun 21, 2011 at 05:30:19 AM PDT

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                  •  For the Progressive Wing (0+ / 0-)

                    to prevail, we must get more real Progresives in office.

                    That's the key.  Once that happens, then there will be little in the way of achieving real Progressive ideals UNLESS there is a Republican sitting in the White House.  

                    Until that happens, however, my hope is that (as a party) we can be patient, understanding that baby steps may be the only progress that can be made knowing and acknowledging that at least its a step (or two) in the right direction.

                     

                    •  I like (0+ / 0-)

                      the first paragraph.

                      The second paragraph is too twisty for me to follow.

                      I passionately disagree with the third paragraph. There was once a time when all mankind lived in a feudal society. With the Enlightenment came the concept of self governance. We've been working at this for some time now. Baby steps will not inspire. We will govern ourselves or we will be ruled. Sadly, and thanks to Citizens United, we don't even know the names of the rulers.

                      Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

                      by Just Bob on Wed Jun 22, 2011 at 06:10:12 AM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

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