Daily Kos

Beware the Bearers of 'Good News'

Thu Oct 16, 2003 at 10:40:43 PM PDT

Thanks to Billmon for weaving some of these threads together.
On returning from a trip to Iraq and Afghanistan, a group of Senate Republicans said yesterday that the Bush administration deserves a lot more credit for successful reconstruction efforts in those war-torn nations.

Meanwhile, several Senate Democrats complained that they were denied access to a plane for an inspection tour of their own.

"For whatever reason, Sens. [Chris] Dodd [D-Conn.] and others who requested the opportunity to travel were prohibited from doing so, and I think that requires a better explanation that the one I’ve been given so far," Minority Leader Tom Daschle (D-S.D.) said.

"We have no understanding. We were told that an [Air Force] airplane was not available," adding that Britain offered them the use of an airplane. "If Britain can offer United States senators an airplane, you would think the United States government could do so as well."

Daschle added: "We have to assume that what [Republican senators] saw is accurate."
For crying out loud, Tom, it’s Dubyanocchio’s Administration. Assume nada.
In recent days, the Bush administration has launched a campaign to blame the news media for portraying the situation in Iraq in a negative light. Last week, Bush described the military spirit as high and said that life in Iraq is "a lot better than you probably think. Just ask people who have been there."

But Stars and Stripes raised questions about what those visiting dignitaries saw in Iraq. "Many soldiers -- including several officers -- allege that VIP visits from the Pentagon and Capitol Hill are only given hand-picked troops to meet with during their tours of Iraq," the newspaper said in its interview with Sanchez. "The phrase 'Dog and Pony Show' is usually used. Some troops even go so far as to say they've been ordered not to talk to VIPs because leaders are afraid of what they might say."
And while a lot of soldiers are griping about the situation, and wondering if their next residence will be a bodybag or the amputee ward, a Texas Republican apparently got her brain switched off from too much exposure to Condi’s Cheerleading Squad:
Rep. Kay Granger (R-Texas) had just returned home from a government-sponsored tour of Iraq when she appeared on Fox News to comment on Sunday's car bombing in Baghdad. Proving she's a good listener, she insisted that the suicide attack was actually good news. How's that? Speaking of the American nation-building effort, she explained, "As it's working, there are more incidents like this, from people who don't want it to work." By that inverted logic, of course, it would be bad news if there were fewer bombings.

But then, undercutting Granger's case, the interviewer noted that Granger and her fellow visitors had not actually stayed overnight in Iraq while they were visiting the country; each night, they were flown back to Kuwait, some 400 miles south of Baghdad. One might think for a moment about the implications of such a long-distance commute. If all the American security in Iraq can't make Iraq secure for VIPs, then maybe Iraq isn't so secure.
Did I read that right? Fox News? The President’s favorite filter?

These Republican daytrippers to Iraq remind of the solidarity brigades that once visited Soviet Russia or Cuba, their ideological blinders shielding them from "flaws" as effectively as any misdirection by their secret police-connected tour guides.
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  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.33 / 3)

    I get the sneaking suspicion that Madeleine Albright saw more naked truth during her visit to North Korea than these senators et al see on their government trips to Iraq.

    I briefly lived in the Middle East, and remembering what I know of the area combined with the EXCELLENT blogs coming from people in Iraq (including US soldiers!) I must say that these VIPs live in some kind of Tom Tomorrow vortex of bizarro world to think anything is even close to hunky dory.

    Has the United States not done one good thing in Iraq? Of course not.  But the overall situation is abysmal and they know it.  They couldn't get 12 ordinary Americans to even compete on Survivor in Iraq the way it is right now - and that's for a million bucks!

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

    Good god, the stupidity of some members of Congress like Granger and Nethercutt is beyond belief.  Our country is indeed in deep sh*! when we have these mindless lemmings running around making their absurd pronouncements.  I'm bummed.

    "We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." - Louis D. Brandeis

    by VA6thDem on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 01:09:22 AM PDT

  •  Griping Soldiers?... (1.62 / 8)

    ...who'da thunk it?

    To the vets who visit this site, think back on your service.

    Question - what didn't soldiers gripe about?

    Like the man said, nothing new under the sun.

    If anything, the war was about 100,000 corpses too late. Victor Davis Hanson

    by OriginalOrrin on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 01:15:57 AM PDT

    •  Re: Griping Soldiers?... (2.75 / 4)

      Griping about the SOS in the cafeteria is just a tad different than griping about being stuck in a hostile country as a target in order to ensure Halliburton's profits.  

      Not to mention the worry about coming home in either a body bag or as an amputee, only to discover your veteran's benefits have been cut to fund yet another tax cut for the "investor class" who aren't, of course, expected to actually DO anything for their country.

      No draft, you know.  Massive exodus of reservists and guard, not to mention lousy re-up incentives.

    •  Re: Griping Soldiers?... (none / 1)

      "The man" also said:
      So I returned, and considered all the oppressions that are done under the sun: and behold the tears of such as were oppressed, and they had no comforter; and on the side of their oppressors there was power; but they had no comforter.
      -- Ec. 4:1

      Vanity of vanities...


      I've got an overload of bottomless thought right here in my left fist

      by Harry Tuttle on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 04:00:03 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Re: Griping Soldiers?..., Nyberg (3.00 / 2)

      "A bitching sailor is a happy sailor."

      I did a little time as a Navy officer and acknowledge that complaints are part and parcel of leading troops.  If the sailors aren't complaining, one needs to worry b/c either the lines of communication have completely shut down, or they are planning a mutiny.

      When a serious mission is being executed, the complaints go way down.  Frankly, it's flattering to be asked to save the world.  And it's a chance to do what we practiced.  Even during a serious inspection, the crew would pull together.

      To get the significance of the complaints, one needs to listen to the substance.  Are servicemembers complaining about the weather?  Are they second-guessing the decisions, on relatively minor points?  Or are they questioning the purpose of the whole mission?

      If you are interested in the politics of Proviso Township in Cook County, Illinois, visit Proviso Probe.

      by Carl Nyberg on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 07:10:10 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    Meanwhile an other three US soldiers and two Iraqi policemen have been killed at Karbala...

    Note that this place is not located in the Sunni triangle but is a Shi'ite Holy place to the south of Baghdad. It's not only in the Sunni Triangle our troops face stiff resistance... but apparantly all is going well and improving according to BushCo.

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    Well, these Reps VIPs are probably the same people who blamed Jane Fonda for going to Hanoi and Sean Penn for going to Baghdad before the war.

    Yep, attacks in Karbala. Apparently they clashed with Sadrists. If the Army decides to round them up or to impose their own order and patrols in Shiite areas, notably Sadr City, the fun is only beginning.
    sigh

    Americans placed the stamp of approval on the least justifiable military action since Hitler invaded Poland. Paul C. Roberts

    by Clueless Joe on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 02:11:58 AM PDT

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    Can anyone tell me why our guys are committing suicide???  12 of them?  I have to go find this story - I'm really sick over this - is this something that happens generally speaking during a war?  I am so saddened and tired of this - let's get a dem in office and get the warmongers OUT!!!

    mwjeepster

    Dissent is Patriotic

    by mwjeepster on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 02:13:08 AM PDT

    •  Suicide (3.50 / 2)

      Well I don't know if this is a correlation or a causation deal, but a number of soldiers have died of some pretty bizarre diseases at the same time that these suicides have been happening.  

      At this point, 2 soldiers have died, and 13 have required hospitalization for pneumonia.  Almost 100 soldiers have come down with it.  Pneumonia?!  These soldiers have been stationed in +100 degree weather for months.  Also, what kinds of horrible epidemiological conditions are there within the ranks that would even allow pneumonia to spread unchecked to 100 people?

      But that's not the only disease in Iraq.  The CDC has warned that soldiers may be infected with TB.  Which, provided it's not one of those crazy drug-resistant strains that they've been having such a hard time with lately, would be easy to treat, except Bush has been cutting veterans' access to healthcare.  Now how's that for "supporting the troops"-- we'll send you to a region where you'll get a nasty infectious disease and then cut the program that lets you get medical care when you get home.  That's compassionate conservatism baby.

      Read James Loewen's "Sundown Towns"!

      by ChicagoDem on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 05:42:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Foiled again by the meddling media! (none / 1)

    In recent days, the Bush administration has launched a campaign to blame the news media for portraying the situation in Iraq in a negative light.

    Heh. Reminds me of Bush's economic theory a while back that it was the media's constant "Rush to War, Rush to War" coverage that led to the sinking stock market.  Nope, it couldn't have been the actual rush to war, just the pesky media's insisting on reporting it.

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    Congressional junkets have been a fabulous source of crap since forever.  It is telling that the gov won't give the Demo's a plane, since Rove knows they won't stick with the talking points.

    Sure, it is a good thing that the schools are open, but what good is that if women and girls are afraid to leave their homes?  Soccer clubs are nice, but how many American lives have to be spent to buy them?  Is that what we sent our troops to Iraq for?

    When congressional junkets support comments like those spewed by George Nethercutt, I say let's keep those Repubs junketing.

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    It seems that Lt. Col. Domenic Caraccilo, who is at the center of the recent U.S. Army astroturf scandal, is no ordinary soldier.

    Check out Justin Raimondo's latest post
    "GOOGLING THE WAR PARTY" at    http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j101703.html

     

    •  Raimondo's piece ... (none / 0)

      I thoroughly enjoy Raimondo's stylish bombast, but often feel he struggles to transfrom tenuous connections into steel cables.

      On the subject of Caraccilo, however, it seems to me he's Googled up a strikingly odd set of "coincidences."

      I am an anti-imperialist. I am opposed to having the eagle put its talons on any other land. -- Mark Twain

      by Meteor Blades on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 07:43:50 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (4.00 / 3)

    Kay Granger is more interested in bifurcating a service award so those serving in the "SW Asia theatre or war on terrorism" have the potential of garnering more "fruit salad" on their chests.

    Is this an nod to the fact that tours of duty will further be extended and troops will be rotated between Iraq and Afghanistan on a regular basis?

    GRANGER INTRODUCES BILL TO AWARD MILITARY SERVICE MEDALS FOR AFGHANISTAN AND IRAQ

    Congresswoman Kay Granger (R- Fort Worth) will introduce a bill today that will require the Defense Department to award separate medals for military service in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Currently, the Department of Defense (DOD) has established an award for service in the global war on terrorism.  This medal can only be issued once to each soldier during his or her entire term of service and does not distinguish between individual campaign fronts in the war on terrorism, specifically Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Granger's bill calls on the Secretary of Defense, Donald Rumsfeld, to establish specific, separate campaign medals for troops serving in Operation Enduring Freedom and Operation Iraqi Freedom.  After a recent visit with U.S. troops in Iraq, Rep. Granger realized this bill was necessary.  The enactment of this bill would ensure that our men and women in uniform receive the recognition they deserve.  

    "While I was in Iraq last week, one question I asked when I met with the troops was `what else can we do for you back home,'" said Granger.  "This legislation came about when I saw men and women who had served both in Afghanistan and Iraq and may serve again in this continuing war on terrorism throughout the world."    

    In the past, the DOD has issued a number of campaign medals for campaigns that were part of larger wars.  For example, three campaign-specific medals were issued during World War II: the American Campaign Service Medal, the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal, and the European-African-Middle Eastern Campaign Medal.  Similarly, DOD issued a Southwest Asia Service Medal for the Persian Gulf War in 1991 and the Kosovo Campaign Medal for the 1999 war in Kosovo.

    Like bonus points for those that have the good fortune of having to serve in two hellholes. I can see this used as a value added pitch in Granger's district by the various armed services recruiters:

    Recruiter: Son/Miss, I see you are ready and rarin' to get into the fight! Guess what? You can now get two combat decorations for serving in our Forever War in Southwest Asia now, thanks to Rep, Kay Granger (R)-Texas. Fantastic opportunity!

    Young person: Uh, where do I sign up to get the paid college money...

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.80 / 5)

    There's little reason for us to believe much of anything in our mass media since all of it is decadent and corrupt.

    Now our White House is on a major campaign to force this decadent and corrupt mass media to succumb entirely to its penchant for propaganda.

    Dubya is ORDERING them to become what they really want to be: Pravda Media.

    It was fun watching the local 'interview' with the Chimp in my market. It consisted of perhaps 45 seconds of sound bites from himself interlarded with graphics of horror and destruction on a massive scale in Iraq. Statements from the president that "everything is fine" followed by standup pieces by correspondents covering this or that incident of mayhem in Baghdad. It was obvious that the interviewer was more than puzzled at the divorcement from reality demonstrated by the interviewee. And it was all they could do to get 45 seconds stitched together from his ravings.

    Nevertheless, when Fox becomes the most reliable American news outlet (we're not there yet!) we may never get back to the right side of the looking glass.

    --felix

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    Is it just me, but I feeling like puking my guts out.

    their ideological blinders shielding them from "flaws" as effectively as any misdirection by their secret police-connected tour guides.

    I am not a religious person, but I thank god eveyday for Dean and Clark, two real Gotaims!

    I hope we can work out the Dean/Clark clash with out too much damage to ourselves, because I am way too old to learn how to goose march.

    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

      Well, if you can't learn to goosestep, I think there'll be this real fun 'camp' out in Montana where you can work real hard out in the fresh air and get paid pretty good for it.
  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.00 / 3)

    I'm not sure if the 'local' news media is getting the message that everything in Iraq is rosy and don't worry about those 'pesky' casualties.

    I live in Colorado Springs, which is bastion of religious conservative thinking.  At one time, more religious headquarters were base here than any other place in the US.  Plus we have Ft. Carson, which is a big army base with soldiers going in and out of the middle-east.  Anyway, on the local news at ten last night (ABC affiliate) the two top stories were the Stars and Stripes survey and the UN vote.  For the Stars and Stripes survey, they mentioned that more than half of the troops were experiencing poor moral and that half of the reserve troops said that they would not re-enlist.  They didn't even mention that one third said that they felt moral was high according to the survey, like the WaPo did.

    They mentioned the UN vote as a `political' victory for Dubya, but the stressed that the vote did not mean more troops or money.  Also, this morning on the way into work, I heard that the Senate decided to make half of the $20 billion grants a loan rather than a give-away.  Couple this with 4 more combat deaths and it is pretty hard to talk about anything `positive'.  I think one just comes off sounding stupid at best or a liar at worst.  Maybe I just have selective hearing.

    Is it just me or does everybody else think that stressing school openings is a bad idea?  Two images come to mind when Repugs talk about schools in Iraq: the failure of `No Child Left Behind' and the fundamentalist schools in Saudi.  I don't think I am the only moderate to think so...

    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.00 / 3)

      We're now three days into the "Dems can't get a plane" story - and what had Daschle done about it? Zip. "Well, I guess that's okay, guys. We'll take your word for it that everything's just keen over there." It make me furious. I don't blame Republicans for acting the way they do any more than I'd blame an untrained dog for sh*tting on the carpet - dogs don't know any better unless somebody is standing by with a rolled up newspaper, ready to smack 'em on their snouts every time they leave a deposit where they shouldn't. When are Daschle and the Congressional/Senatorial Dems going to roll up their newspapers and let the Republicans have it?
      •  Re: Lack of plane - (none / 1)

        No question, the D leadership should be on this, hard.  Here is one to observe for spine ratings and a view into the learning curve that some of us had hoped to see from the Dems wrt opposition.

        The bottom line, the Dems need to get there, by hook or by crook...

      •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

        While I agree that Daschle is a utterly spineless wimp, what exactly can/should the Demos in Congress do? You can't wap the dog with a newspaper if you don't have a newspaper.

        It's pronounced "Gooey-Duck"!

        by geoduck on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 05:33:13 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

          No, but you can yell really loudly at the guy selling the newspapers.
        •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

          Dems have to learn to play the media's worst side - its desire for conflict. If I were Daschle,I'd get on the plane with other loudmouth Dems and a camera crew of my own. I'd make it known as I left Washington that I was going to Iraq, in spite of the administration's attempts to stop me. I'd show up at an Iraqi border entrance and demand to be let in. If they stopped me I'd raise high holy hell on camera - and give the film to any media outlet - foreign or domestic - that would air it. It would inevitably filter onto US TV screens - and I would follow it up with interviews accusing Bush of having something to hide since he doesn't want opposition party leaders in to see what's going on. I'd keep it up until I got in - then I'd raise hell every time I was slighted - not provided a military guide, not permitted to go where I want, not permitted to speak to those I wanted to speak to. If I couldn't get in the first time, I'd send other Dems in my place and have the camera crew film them being turned away at the border. I'd also filibuster all consideration of the $87 billion Bush wants until the Dems were allowed to see first hand what American dollars are buying.
  •  I wish "the media" would hit back (3.50 / 2)

    I wish "the media" would laugh, scorn, and mock to death the idea that "the media" possesses a homogeneous political bias, and esp. one as ridiculous as that described by the White House. Sure, it is flattering to hear that the President thinks you are a kingmaker, and some members of the media may actually harbor this delusion, but this is poison flattery and no serious news man or news woman should countenance it.

    It was one thing for the narcotic-addicted Rush Limbaugh to propose such lunatic conspiracy theories. It's another thing for the White House to do the same.

    Any sane and serious reporter would be right to ignore the ravings of Rush. I'm astonished, however, and even outraged that more members of the media aren't hitting back at this childish and wrong accusation of bias.

    Is this not, to date, the most serious attack on the credibility, objectivity, and professionalism of our journalists?

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

    Is it me, or isn't it a really bad idea for Shrub to openly declare the mainstream media bad at what they do? Um, wouldn't this ultimately, uh, um, backfire?

    Could Bush04 look like Gore00?

  •  Republican Shills Do Iraq (none / 1)

    Well, this explains quite a bit.  I've been seeing Mitch McConnell (R-KY) spout pollyannish drivel all week on assorted news programs (he just got back from Iraq, and things are just sooooooo wunnerful!), and my blood pressure can't handle much more of him.  (To their credit, MSNBC has been using him as the Administration Punching Bag all week.)  

    Now, why wouldn't the White House invite democrats in congress to take the Iraq Fall Colors Tour?  Could they be guilty of...news filtering?????

  •  Democrats and Iraq money (3.33 / 3)

    It's easy to beat-up on Republicans here.  Yes, they are continuing to spin events in Iraq in a way that it doesn't sound like a clusterfix; this is challenging when it is a clusterfix.  However, let's talk about the Dems.

    I was driving through Wisconsin last night, listening to Rep. Brad Sherman get interviewed on the BBC.  I found Sherman's representation of the Democratic position offensive.

    1. He engaged in significant bombast against Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and the UAE which seemed somewhat irrelevant and frankly, anti-semitic (as in anti-Arab).  He definitely implied the U.S. invasion served Gulf state interests and therefore they should pay.  How would it have played if he claimed the U.S. invasion of Iraq served Israeli interests and therefore Iraq money should at least partially come from military aid to Israel?
    2. I find it offensive that Dems who voted for the war are now balking at the price tag and asking for a loan to Iraq.  Demand Bush admit he lied, fine.  Demand a partial repeal of Bush taxcut.  But saddling Iraq with debt?  This makes little sense.  The United States chose to invade Iraq without the backing of UN Security Council.  Sherman and a whole bunch of Dems voted for it.  The loans issue is bogus.

    If you are interested in the politics of Proviso Township in Cook County, Illinois, visit Proviso Probe.

    by Carl Nyberg on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 04:26:11 AM PDT

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.75 / 4)

    Apparently Daschle's brain has been switched off as well.  Perhaps he meant to say:

    "Of course, we'll have to assume that everything the Republican tourists say is total horsesh*t, since they have a massive political (and in most cases financial) investment in the Iraq occupation."

    The utter density is unbelievable.  Here's a question for the political analysts:  why has the Democratic leadership in congress completely failed to understand the Dean phenomenon?  Whether you like the guy or not, it's easy to see that much of his support comes from people disgusted with the lack of any opposition in DC.  

    Yet the "Washington insiders" still aren't getting the message.  People are angry.  Even conservatives are waking up to the fact that they can't trust this administration farther than they can throw Dick Cheney.  And yet Daschle's still spouting his meek little concessions:  "well, we were totally excluded from the process for an obviously bogus reason, but we'll just assume the most duplicitous administration in history gave their minions an honest and complete accounting."  Pathetic.

    •  Re: Daschle, Dem Leadership... (none / 1)

      hmm.  Daschle, it has been suggested in the past that part of this particular problem is the tension of keeping his seat in his state.

      Certainly I look to see more from him than I have seen, and I am not happy.

      Does anyone have any insight into the likelihood/possibility of his losing when his senate seat comes up? Or just how tenuous his support is?  
      God knows the whole Janklow story stank to high heaven and reflected badly on that state.

      I have thought for a long time we need a Senate Minority Leader from a safer state, esp with '04 coming.  Frankly I have had it to the nth degree with congress and the pretzel.  I detest the view I am forced to have in desperate times, too much pointless inside gaming - and for what?, for what I call an eternal seat at the useless table.

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.66 / 3)

    It's obvious that anyone working in "the media" is doing exactly what every single other power-broker is doing in this country: looking out for #1. "#1", being, of course, themselves. In other words, the media has its own interests at stake more than anything else; they want to sell papers (as it were), not sell ideology. And whether your news outlet is conservative or liberal or somewhere in-between, news is news. Whatever people want to buy, that's what you have to report if you don't want to lose business. That's just plain old capitalism: money trumps everything, ideology, religion, politics, you name it . . . everything.

    This is why Bush's little media campaign thing will have absolutely zero effect; he can go on and on about how good Iraq is going, but it's not going to sell papers the way that "2 DEAD, 4 WOUNDED" (or some other such headline) will. "The media" wants something juicy more than anything else; they want to make money, just like everyone else. I mean, who in this country puts ideology ahead of cash? Hard-core liberals and Buddhist monks, maybe, but none of them are running any newspapers that I'm aware of. (Yes, I'm sure there are some nice, ardent socialist publications out there, but I don't think those are what Bush is targeting with his dog & pony show; his complaint is aimed at the "liberal bias" of the major outlets, which as far as I'm concerned have about zero political bias period when compared to their "pro-income" bias.)

    Blood sells newspapers. That's the bottom line. This will happen regardless of who's in power in the WH; the only real difference in this case being that Dubya is causing a lot more bloodshed than the last few presidents did, so he feels personally targeted when the media focuses on it. Trust me, George, when Dean or Clark takes up in January 2005, the media's going to keep focusing on Iraq's problems without skipping a beat. Just wait, you'll see.

    Save a spotted owl: eat a logger

    by Tlacolotl on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 04:41:03 AM PDT

    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (4.00 / 3)

      This is far too simplistic a view of the media. Certainly the object has to do with money, but not by selling newspapers.

      Thom Hartmann has a very good piece on conservative media today in Common Dreams:

      The Battle Hymn of the New Liberal Media: A Good Business Plan

      In this piece he writes:

      The 1980s saw massive funding of right-wing think tanks that have engaged in blitzkrieg campaigns to overwhelm the mainstream media with conservative viewpoints. The man whose followers claim he's Jesus Christ's reincarnation, Reverend Moon, started the Washington Times newspaper in 1982, and although it has lost money ever since, it has succeeded in pushing political discourse in Washington to the far right, presumably helping the good Reverend's other military/industrial investments and lent legitimacy to his religion. Republican operative and former Rush Limbaugh TV Show producer Roger Ailes, with access to Rupert Murdoch's billions, founded the Fox News Network to openly push the Republican agenda into America's living rooms.

      And they have been successful:

      The result of conservatives buying their way into our airwaves has been a conservative transformation in average Americans' political viewpoints. Soccer Moms and NASCAR Dads tune in to coast-to-coast, dawn-to-midnight conservative talk radio, and many have come to believe the right's slogans and myths.

      So, what we have is not a desire to sell papers, ie. "If it bleeds it leads. . ."  There is plenty of bleeding going on that is being thinly reported or not reported at all, because it does not support the right wing agenda.

      What drives the mainstream media is certainly money. But, it is the money that the media's corporate parents and their executive elites are making in collaboration with the Bush fascistic government.

      What has happened is the corporate crooks have taken over BOTH the government AND the media.  The agenda being pursued by the government amounts to a confidence game. They are con-artists intent on looting the public trust, and the media are their complicit shills.  What's a few million from "selling newspapers" when there are billions upon billions to be liberated from the US Treasury?

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (2.50 / 2)

    Hmmmm-ah-hmmmm, here I am with my second attempt at comments.  The first 2 completely failed because MB had a "subject" that was over 50 characters.  I thought it was my subject in the comment field, not the title of the post.  Pissed me off.

    Then this morning I see this:  "Let me make one thing clear -- rankings are here to stay."

    Hmmmm-ah-hmmmm, let me make one thing perfectly clear:  it would behoove you to keep an eagle eye on your hit count since you implemented scoop.  I know you've gone down at least 10%, possibly a lot more.  Humans don't like change.

    I understand the reasons for the change, but your mind and logic will simply not dictate the direction of this site all by itself, Markos.  I've been extremely leery of these "rankings" ever since I saw the idea.

    It will give the egotists utter fits.  It has the very nasty potential to encourage a kind of group-think as commenters look to the rankings "leaders" to say what would keep them in line with the gods.

    [shrugs]  Okay.  They're here to stay.  All I'm trying to say is that you better be very, very careful.  I like the old comment way a lot, lot better.  I don't know hardly anything in this world and I'm sure I'll adjust.  Others will not and will stop coming to the site.

    How much of a bleed you want to suffer for this is up to you. It's not my blog.  I'm just telling you there will be push-back to that kind of thinking, and it won't be easy to perceive, not in the least.  The most obvious indicator will be your hit count, but unfortunately the beeding will creep in a lot of ways you'll never see.

    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.00 / 2)

      Two days later, I'm comfortable with the rankings. Almost nobody gets hidden (and less stay hidden).

      Re groupthink/thought leaders by ranking, well, methinks, not likely to affect the Dem primary thread...

      I think everyone's been a lot more civil, and I think maybe the rankings have something to do with it. Even if temporary, it's probably a good thing.

      Re ego, egad! Us? For those with a strong ego, Kos encourages you to write a diary. For the rest of us, let's hope the rankings are based on quality of thought, not agree/disagree with theme. We'll see how the principled conservatives who occasionally visit make out. I think that's hte best way to address your real and valid concerns. Overall, as stated, I'm feeling better about this rank thing every day, esp. with the ability to turn it off.

      "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho Marx

      by DemFromCT on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 05:11:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

        As I say, it's not up to me.  One of my favorite quotes is from Herman Wouk:  "Do it and see."

        So I'll do it and see.  Watch and wait the whole time.

        I was frankly surprised at how angry I got from those rejected comments of mine--I live in the browser and yet didn't see the problem.  Many users with personalities similar to mine would have never come back after those failed first attempts.

        Beginnings are extremely delicate and perilous times.  I love Markos and this site and want it to succeed.  It's why my reaction surprises me; even with that knowledge squarely in my head when I saw the words let me make this perfectly clear my reaction was instant:  fuck you.  I despise arrogant authority, and although that's the last thing Markos wanted to convey that was my reaction.

        If that was my reaction he better be careful, is all.  This is a very, very complex evolution, and although I'm fascinated I'm worried the site will suffer.

    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

      I am fairly opposed to rankings, but i totally understand the need for them . As kos has pointed out , he had to spend lots of time patrolling this site to keep it from breaking down with bullshit posts from trolls. I would think, given some reflection, everyone could appreciate that fact, and if it makes it easier for Kos hey I'm all for it.This is an awesome site.         And for the 'humans who dont like change', well unfortunately thats a sad commentary on our species.Evolution is awesome,  it promotes creativity and challenges us to create our destiny and take responsibility for the manifestation of our aspirations in building a better world.
    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

      I've been eyeing this new format suspiciously for a few days now. Mostly, while I hate ratings systems, period, and find them essentially elitist, hey, we're talking "liberal" here, right.

      What the fuck did I expect-, full blown egalitarianism?

      Mostly, I just hated/hate the "security breach" of giving out my email to all but "the chosen few". Whatever the "best intentions" of kos, what are his potential links and/or unknown "susceptibilities" to Homeland Defence type spooks. (I know, one's IP address is available to them anyway. Having your email though, makes it easier for the twaddles.)

      In the end, I just said, "Fuck it." I mean, at my age, how much longer am I going to fucking live anyway?

      While I may live to regret it, in any evolving social, as in a battlefield war, there has to be those foolish enough to step forward and volunteer-, I guess.

      And I've lived long enough to know better.

      Fuck!

      •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

        Mostly, I just hated/hate the "security breach" of giving out my email to all but "the chosen few". Whatever the "best intentions" of kos, what are his potential links and/or unknown "susceptibilities" to Homeland Defence type spooks. (I know, one's IP address is available to them anyway. Having your email though, makes it easier for the twaddles.)

        Want to be completely 'anonymous'? Just get a free web-mail account and use that instead of your 'real' one. You only have to check it once for the confirmation e-mail. Problem solved.

        Sheesh.

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

    The brother of my daughter's best friend is coming home in a body bag.  We'll soon have a funeral to attend.  Perhaps Granger and Bush would like to join us.  
    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

      The trouble with mass market propaganda is that once the customer listened to the "pitch" and has bought a "lemon" that propaganda isn't going to work anymore.  Propaganda only works if there is no conflicting true information and it caters into the psychology and prejudices of the listener.

      The neo-cons propaganda efforts have failed; the Valerie Plame Affair has broken open.  The Bush II Realists are conflict leaking.  The body-bags keep coming home.

      P.S.  I'm having cookie problems also.  It appears in IE 6 you have to use the logged in site in your IE Favorite list.  Kos you may want to start a thread on "Solving dKos Cookie Problems"

      •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (3.50 / 2)

        Jim, I like to think that, too, but there's a problem with that logic/psychology: some people who've bought lemons realize that they've bought lemons, but instead of turning against the lemon, or lemon-dealers in general, or people who put lemons in deceptive ads, bitter lemon buyers now have more invested in believing that the lemon is in fact what they wanted, and that they're happy with it. And there are people who've bought lemons, and suspect that they have lemons, but don't want to admit to themselves or anyone else that they got suckered, because it'd be embarrassing to think of themselves that way, or to know that others do.

        It's not that so many people agree with Bush, but that so many people want to believe they do. We might have to change those people's minds not only about Bush, but about themselves. That's what'll be hard...

        Since Bush said "We're not leaving [Iraq] while I'm the president," that means you're either for years of more war or you're for impeachment. Your choice.

        by Christopher on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 07:23:56 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

    it is funny when al gore announce the TV network everyone immediately said that liberal network would fail and what does al say "oh this isn't a liberal network  this is aimed at youth" in other words he ONCE again bought into mediawhores spin..
    •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

      Damn. Gore should've just said, "It's a network about the FACTS. If that turns out to be incompatible with conservatives, then that's their problem, and it tells you as much about them as it does about us."

      And if he can work "fair and balanced" into anything, so much the better. "Fair and Balanced Al Gore"? Or maybe a FAB five (stealing from Queer Eye and Michigan basketball simultaneously?) something?

      Since Bush said "We're not leaving [Iraq] while I'm the president," that means you're either for years of more war or you're for impeachment. Your choice.

      by Christopher on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 07:28:36 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Bush sowing seeds of his own demise (3.50 / 2)

    Last week, Bush described the military spirit as high and said that life in Iraq is "a lot better than you probably think. Just ask people who have been there."

    How do you think this plays with comrades of the dead and wounded?

    What did Bush say about the most reliable source of information?  His most accurate source of information is his advisors?

    Bush is basically saying the dead only count when being used as symbols to bolster his policies.

    Bush has said that no matter how bad the objective evidence gets that things are not going well, as long as his advisors tell he everything is OK, he won't change course.  Would you risk your life for a man that says his advisors trump any source of independent information he receives?

    If you are interested in the politics of Proviso Township in Cook County, Illinois, visit Proviso Probe.

    by Carl Nyberg on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 08:32:41 AM PDT

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 1)

    Part of the intent of my first post above was, to make a comment on MB's article here, or mostly a subsidiary observation.

    I've been much interested watching the situation re the U.S. "approval" resolution on Iraq at the UN. While I am some surprised at the euro/russia coaltion going along, even to the limited "saving America's face" extent that they did, I think I am beginning to understand why.

    And that is the point, of course, the "Old World Alliance" has accepted the need for themselves to stay on the "good side" of Uncle Sam for as long as they can, because of the economic and other "strategic" issues, while they continue to conspire amongst themselves in the background, to firm up their own strategic positions. (Amerika is still IT, militarily speaking.) It is the falling "economic chips" in the Battle of The Currencies, that is The Old World's truly most powerful weapon over the long haul.

    Meanwhile, humour the Americans as long as you can.

    The fact is, other than achieving some short term PR points to run with for awhile, what the U.S. actually has in their hands is essentially water-, that will rapidly, is rapidly leaking away through their fingers, as we speak. They have nothing more, of substantively helpful military assets and hard cash, after the passage of their "hollow" resolution at the UN, than what they had before. Russia is not going to send any troops or cash, neither is Germany or France. All that was given, was a face saving gesture.

    Meanwhile, what France, Russia and Germany have bought for themselves by tactically "going along" with a desparate U.S. White House is-, time, critical time: Time to get their shit together amongst themselves and firm up whatever it is they are cooking up to protect their own strategic interests in the Middle East.

    Politics, like sex, makes for strange bedfellows, and it is not always clear whom is fucking who, or who is on top and who is on the bottom.

    More important than this PR shilling (schilling?)going on at the UN is, what is occurring on the ground in Iraq. It is there the truth is really unfolding and will be told. And in that regard, keep your eye, I think, on the Shia, the Sunni, and the increasingly pissed off as well, Kurds.

    The last one now is very often, the later to win-, in real life.

  •  Re: Beware the Bearers of 'Good News' (none / 0)

    Daschle is a joke. What good is maintaining your seat if you don't, or can't, do anything with it? It merely proves what a sham democracy truly is in America today. We truly are a Fascist nation, oh, I mean "Neo-conservative", it's just nobody wants to admit it. Instead, the majority of Americans and major media run around pretending America is still a democracy, because that way they can avoid confrontation and pretend everything is OK. The question isn't when will America wake up. The question is, how many will have to die before America wakes up and will there still be enough time and resources to save it if/when they do?

    Perhaps someone could explain to the Democratic Party that there is a literal "Civil War" going on within America and that if they don't put together forces to combat it, then they are going to become extinct? I mean, yes, the Democrats are right on many of the issues and have better ideas and tend to be more trustworthy than the Republicans. But the Republicans are no longer interested in playing politics. They want power and they are taking it. They already own the voting systems and the media. Unless the Democrats begin fighting back with everything they have, they can expect to continue to play politics right into oblivion.

    The sleep of reason produces monsters.

    by Alumbrados on Fri Oct 17, 2003 at 12:56:52 PM PDT

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