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This is going to get ugly. And surreal. But the American Taliban have Frist in their grip, and won't relinquish until they have their Afghanistan-style theocracy.

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:16 PM PDT.

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Comment Preferences

  •  weird (4.00)
    is it just me, or does the gavel/bible look photoshopped in?  I wonder who that kid is and if they got permission...

    Politology.US - Politics and Technology in the United States

    by tunesmith on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:07:51 PM PDT

  •  The Crusades (none)

    "Leadership and learning are indispensable to each other." - JFK

    by jillian on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:08:30 PM PDT

    •  re (none)
      and just think. Now with the new movie coming out "Kingdon of Heaven' we will get to see how they did it in the good ole days and then just poke our head out our window to see how crusades are done today.

      GOB Bluth + unknown woman + high school = Steve Holt!

      by cookiesandmilk on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:11:08 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's a stupid argument (4.00)
      and I sincerely hope that it will get smacked down quickly.  We've approved plenty of Christian judges.  The only ones we don't like are the ones who want to legislate Christianity (or any other religion) from the bench.
  •  Jesus H. Christ (none)
    It's going to get worse before it gets better, isn't it?
  •  Bill Kristol Tried to Dance Around... (4.00)
    ...this crap this morning when it was brought up on NPR's Diane Rheem Show that Frist is a speaker at this event.

    That's correct, Frist is speaking at this event.

    •  the NYTimes story (none)
      I avoided reading it most of today because I just didn't want to know... but here's the link

      the NYT is doing its standard "neutrality" thing by not mentioning the disproportionality or outright falsehood of the claims being made by the wingnuts, and instead "reporting" only "the repugs say this, while the dems reply with that."

      I don't want to live in a theocracy, I really really don't.

  •  Great. (4.00)
    I may vomit all day.

    Rage, rage, against the lying of the Right.

    by Maryscott OConnor on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:09:41 PM PDT

  •  I thought it was a teaser poster for a movie. (4.00)
    Although I guess it could be one for "A Confederacy of Dunces"...
  •  This is making me very sad (none)
    They are ruining my Friday and I am PISSED!

    "Get your American flag out of your blind spot, bitch!"

    by KB on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:10:15 PM PDT

    •  RETALIATE (none)
      go to their website and place an order for your free copy of their anti gay booklet. Order some for your friends while you;re at it! Bleed the bastards dry!!

      You can kill a flock of sheep with witchcraft, provided you also feed them arsenic.

      by Lud on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:23:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That's a great idea (none)
        Make them go through millions of them. Pay for printing AND postage, so we can use them for... toilet paper maybe? Campfire starters?
        •  Send 'em to people who will get p*ssed (none)
          We should send them to every interest group that would be horrified by it. Let's use their money to earn them some powerful enemies.

          Those of you who read the Daily Kos -- in your opinion has the writing changed recently? Were they always this well orgranized and activist?

          by HeyThereItsEric on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:24:00 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I know (none)
            You know all that junk mail you get with the postage paid reply envelopes?

            Stuff it (really stuff it) with their fliers.

            Not only does it cost them the printing/mailing costs, it costs the junk mailers the postage and time it takes to throw it all away.

            It will make the credit card companies furious.

            •  Hah! (none)
              That's great.

              Alternatively, you could order that stuff from them and wait for the RNC to start sending you real-mail spam around election times (my father was (was) a fourty-year moderate-y Republican) and then give them some of their own stuff back.

              Of course, they've sent big postcards lately...

              The Shapeshifter's Blog -- Politics, Philosophy, and Madness!

              by Shapeshifter on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 04:42:06 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  No he shouldn't (4.00)
    And that's why we have separation of church and state.

    . . . solutions emerge from [our] judicious study of discernible reality.

    by realitybased on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:10:19 PM PDT

    •  Except... (none)
      ...the poster seems to say that you can be a judge or a christian, not both. Which is absurd.

      Although you're probably right, what they're trying to break down is the separation of church and state. And I think they wouldn't get too far with that.

      So they have to try with this hamhanded abomination.

      "Never vote for Republicans again -- we lie." --a senior Republican Senator

      by mecki on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:13:22 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  It's absurd only because (4.00)
        we have separation of church and state. If, for example, this kid followed his own, more accurate interpretation of Christ, the religious right would never let him be a judge in the theocracy they hope to create.

        . . . solutions emerge from [our] judicious study of discernible reality.

        by realitybased on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:18:49 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  It's absurd to you (4.00)
        But it is the way these people see the truth. And this is a far more effective poster than anyone here seems willing to admit.

        It reduces the complexities of separation of powers, separation of church and state, and good and evil into an eaasily digestible one liner. This is an ad that could be used in every church in the nation.

        They have already "gotten away" with blurring the line of separation, by the way.

        We are living in a Christian nation. We are fighting a Christian war, led by a Christian crusader. No amount of name-calling will stop them and I suggest we start producing some posters of our own.

        For a Civil Union

        by Hgrove on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:45:19 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  But let's be careful with the wording (4.00)
          We are living in a Christian nation. We are fighting a Christian war, led by a Christian crusader.
          We are living is a nation controlled by a Christian crusader. However, the US is not now and never has been a Christian nation. That's an important point of American history that the theocrats are trying to obscure.

          . . . solutions emerge from [our] judicious study of discernible reality.

          by realitybased on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:02:09 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Important Distinction (none)
            Yes you make a very important distinction.
            We cannot accept their rhetoric as truth.
            The right wing can say we are a Christian nation run by Christian leaders and we should  have All Christian judges, All Christian Senators, Governors etc..but that does not make it True or Valid.

            Instead we have to keep saying...THEY think it is a Christian Nation and make sure to emphasize THEY means the right wing extremists. I do not care if the right wing extremists have the POWER and RUN the country now...we cannot EVER repeat their Rhetoric as though it was the Truth we risk giving a tone of Validity to their sayings. ..if that makes sense.

            We choose hope over despair; possibilities over problems, optimism over cynicism.-John Edwards

            by wishingwell on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:11:11 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  And that is the Law of the land (4.00)
            Look up the Treaty of Tripoli, where it is stated outright that the United States is not a Christian nation.

            Then look at the Constitution and see what it has to say about treaties.

    •  Time to hack the photo ... (4.00)
      "He should not have to choose ...
      ... between both or neither."

      "Defend a free America for people of all faiths:
      Oppose a Christianity requirement for public service."

      Proud member of the reality-based minority

      by Bearpaw on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:48:45 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I think... (none)
    he's choosing public service since he seems to be looking at the gavel more than the Bible.

    That's the way to be patriotic, little boy!

    What's madness but nobility of the soul at odds with circumstance?

    by slinkerwink on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:10:34 PM PDT

  •  This is ridiculous (3.96)
    It looks like a liberal's idea of what conservatives think. The evidence suggests that this is a Democratic Dirty Trick.

    Hindrocket and the Powerline bloggers

  •  The gospel according to Frist (4.00)
    Here's what we wrote at Facing South:

    Today's New York Times reports that "Senator Bill Frist, the majority leader, has agreed to join a handful of prominent Christian conservatives in a telecast portraying Democrats as 'against people of faith' for blocking President Bush's nominees.'"

    God's supposed displeasure with a U.S. Senate procedure, the filibuster (although for those who take the bible literally, no chapter and verse was cited) will be front and center in the proceedings:

    Fliers for the telecast, organized by the Family Research Council and scheduled to originate at a Kentucky megachurch the evening of April 24, call the day "Justice Sunday" and depict a young man holding a Bible in one hand and a gavel in the other.

    The flier does not name participants, but under the heading "the filibuster against people of faith," it reads: "The filibuster was once abused to protect racial bias, and it is now being used against people of faith."

    Josh at Talking Points Memo notes the irony:
    I don't know which is more amusing -- the wingnut jihad against a federal judiciary that is already predominantly Republican or the fact that the intellectual and often literal descendents of the upholders of Jim Crow now seek to enlist the dark legacy of segregation as some sort of arrow in their rhetorical quiver.
    Amen -- how do Trent Lott or Haley Barbour feel about such talk?

    And speaking of "racial bias" ...

    Blogging for a Progressive South

    by ProgressiveSouth on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:10:41 PM PDT

  •  Words fail me (none)
    It should be easy to find any number of judges who have 'faith in christ' and see no need to choose between the two.

    Besides, aren't the appointees mainly just right-wing nutcases, not religious nutcases? Or has Bush been trying to appoint Roy Moore.

    "Never vote for Republicans again -- we lie." --a senior Republican Senator

    by mecki on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:10:41 PM PDT

    •  Dems can paint this attacking religious judges (4.00)
      Because it clearly means that anyone who was confirmed had to give up their religious beliefs to get confirmed.  

      So it's clearly stating that no sitting federal judges are faithful Christians.

  •  This is just sick (4.00)
    I think this little bit of work need a LOT of airtime.  Let them use this, because far too many people are going to have the reaction that I did...utter disgust.

    There are bagels in the fridge

    by Sychotic1 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:10:46 PM PDT

  •  Holy shit. (4.00)
    The bigger question is should he have to choose between criminal insanity and reason.  
  •  WTF??????? (4.00)
    Last time I looked they still use Bibles to swear people in before they testify in court.....

    "In God We Trust" is still on all our legal tender....

    and "one nation under God" is part of our Pledge of Allegiance (at least since the commie-fearing 50s)

    Good luck being an out atheist and getting elected as dogcatcher ANYWHERE in the good old US of A

    •  swearing in (none)
      "Last time I looked they still use Bibles to swear people in before they testify in court....."

      Not always; I believe the court systems (federal and state)
      will allow for affirmations, for those who cannot use a


      •  Actually (none)
        They allow affirmations for those who don't believe in swearing, which came about mostly because of the large number of Pietiests in the US early on who fled Europe when they wouldn't swear loyalty to their country. (Not because they weren't loyal, but because they didn't swear.) Although, I believe you could ask to swear by the Constitution instead of the Bible, possibly other Holy books.
    •  Well, not everywhere... (4.00)
      Here in Maryland, the swearing in doesn't include any Bible-touching, nor does it even end with the phrase "so help me God."  You simply swear under penalties of perjury that the statements you will make shall be the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

      On the other hand, "Faith in Christ" versus "Public service" is a false dichotomy of quite astonishing proportions.  They are in no way incompatible...unless you intend to disregard the law when it conflicts with your individual religious beliefs.... which of course would be the heinous "judicial activism" that these same people rail against out of the other side of their mouths.

      I want to see these American Taliban find any evidence of any judge's confirmation EVER being denied merely because that (potential) judge was a Christian, as opposed to a Christian who was not willing to uphold the rule of law. If you can't apply and uphold the law impartially as to the parties to the dispute in front of you, you have no business being a judge, whether or not it's because of your belief in Christ, Gaia, anarchy, socialism, or neo-conservatism.

      •  Evidence? (none)
        "Evidence" is for those of us in the Reality-based Community.

        Our Leaders just rely on hearsay and magical thinking.

      •  You don't get it.. (none)
        "disregarding the law when it conflicts with your individual religious beliefs" is exactly what these Chriscons want judges to do. They don't consider that judicial activism, judicial activism is when a judge makes a decision based on the law rather than along the Chriscons chosen, and vocally expressed, views. They want all judges to use the Bible as their law book and throw out the rest of the laws, including the Constitution. They aren't interested in rule of law, they want a "Christian nation" where the laws are taken out of the Bible, and interpreted by "Christian" judges. Of course, what they don't realize, is that should that actually happen, most of them would end up in prison. How many of them have not stolen, committed adultery, honored their mothers and fathers, etc. How many of them have taken bribes? Christ preached tolerance, not hate. My question is, what would happen to all the Jewish judges? Would they remove Ruth Ginsburg from the Supremes? And then what, burn her at the stake for not being a Christian? These people aren't reasonable, thinking people, they are religious fanatics.

        What happens when Bush takes Viagra? he gets taller. Robin Williams

        by Demfem on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:06:22 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •   "you have no business being a judge" (none)
        right, they can all become...pharmacists!

        My f-ing God.Oh wait, I forgot - I'm not a Republican, I don't have a God!

        As long as I count the votes, what are you going to do about it? - William Marcy Tweed

        by sidnora on Sat Apr 16, 2005 at 07:42:06 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  They allow (none)
      the use of something else if you dont want to use it. Thats how they get around it. You dont have to . its considered a personal choice.

      Wasn't there one president who wasn't sworn in on the bible? i seem to remember that but I'm not sure. anyone know for sure?

      •  Presidents who affirmed rather than swore an oath (none)
        "Franklin Pierce was the first president to affirm rather than swear the oath of office (1853). Herbert Hoover followed suit in 1929".

        I found this reference, but I am not sure why President Pierce would affirm. None of the sources I found explained the reason. Pierce seems to have been an Episcopalian. President Hoover was a Quaker, so he probably objected to an oath on religious grounds.

        Further citation from The American Memory site of the Library of Congress.

        "March 4, 1853 -- Franklin Pierce
        1.Drove to and from the Capitol standing up in his carriage.
        2.Affirmed (rather than swore) the oath of office.
        3.Broke precedent by not kissing the Bible, but merely placing his left hand on it.
        4.First president to deliver inaugural address without referring to notes".

        There is no man alive who is sufficiently good to rule the life of the man next door to him. Sir Rhys Hopkin Morris, M.P.

        by Gary J on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:37:28 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  What an abomination! (4.00)

    Give me a break already!  Stupid fundies.

    Where can I buy a "Tax the Church" t-shirt?

  •  Lincoln (none)
    Lincoln - freeing slaves = kudos,
    reuniting us with the south= ummmm  not so sure
    •  Careful, (4.00)
      don't lump the whole South in with this crowd of yahoos.  There are PLENTY of freethinking libs, Dems, progressives, socialists, what-have-yous, south of the Mason-Dixon Line.
      •  assdf (none)
        not PLENTY enough.

        and there probably weren't PLENTY of freethinking libs, dems, progressives, socialists, what-have-yous right after the Civil War so your point is moot in the context of this thread.

        •  No doubt. (none)
          But what I'm saying is that it's a mistake to think of the South as a one-size-fits-all, red state bloc of ignorant, toothless conservative yahoos.  Sure, there's plenty of them out there, but there's plenty of freethinkers out there also.  My own state of NC went (by the exit polls, not the fraudulent post-election count) 52-48 for Bush.  That's pretty close to a dead heat, more than enough to keep NC in play in 2006 and 08 if the Dems will just realize that and move on it.  Other Southern states are tougher nuts to crack, but there are freethinking libs, Dems, what have yous, everywhere, even in the deepest and most Confederate-leaning portions of the South.
    •  Yes - in the End perhaps the South won the War (none)
      Exactly what many have been saying............
  •  Unbelievable PSA from American Family Association (none)
    Click here to listen
  •  I don't get it... (none)
    I don't understand how the boy has anything to do with filibuster'ing bad judges. Maybe I'm just dense, or maybe there is some kind of code that only a Christian would get, but coudl somebody please explain this to me.
    •  One word (none)

      Let the great world spin for ever down the ringing grooves of change. - Tennyson

      by bumblebums on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:14:12 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I still don't get it. (none)
        What does someone having a public service career have to do with Schiavo. As far as I'm aware, nobody has suggested that public employees can't worship the God or gods of their choice. What does this poster have to do with judges?
        •  Of course you're right-- no one says (none)
          that public servants can't worship God.  This debate isn't about making sense, it's about stoking fear.

          I would urge you to look into the case of former Alabama Supreme Court Chief Justice Ray Moore.  He was booted from office for refusing to remove a Ten Commandments monument from the courthouse.  Moore and the fundies claim--wrongly-- that he was removed from office for acknowledging God.  Absurd, but effective.

          During the election (I believe it was West Virginia) conservatives claimed that the Democratic Party was trying to ban the Bible.

          It doesn't have to be true, it doesn't have to make sense.  But it does make some conservatives feel persecuted and fires them up to support the GOP.

      •  Bubble people (none)
        They are now speaking in so closed a code that their message is nearly incomprehensible to ordinary people. Hope they don't notice before the next election.

        "Salvation is by way of the truth, not by way of the fatherland" -- Chaadaev

        by sagesource on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:31:56 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I am in your boat... (4.00)
      I am quite disgusted by the picture and imagery and similarly don't understand it.

      I assume it is just propaganda trying to rile up the religious right in favor of abolishing the filibuster by associating the Bible with politics, despite the lack of any real connection. You know, kind of like those pamphlets dispensed during the election which claimed democrats wanted to outlaw the Bible... Or maybe it is suggesting the filibuster is used to prevent 'Christian' nominees from becoming Judges and thereby vicariously intruding on the practice of Christianity itself. Either way, it's absolutely disgusting to suggest the Democrats have used the filibuster to violate anybody's freedom to practice their religion.

      What ever happened to honest discourse? Why must politics be diluted down into emotive manipulation?! sigh...

      "Oh, how I miss the days of Monica Lewinsky..."

      by LawSkoolPunk on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:22:47 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  That makes sense... (4.00)
        the last bit.  Suggesting that Christian judicial nominees are the only ones being filibustered.  It's falling into place now.  I read something about that tack. They are going to claim that the reason the judges are being filibustered is because they are fundamentalist Christian.  

        It's a pretty powerful argument for the non-real-world crowd, because they have been told for years the Christians are being persecuted (although I doubt they could come up with a single conrete example of how).  Of course, it's simple to counter with the real-world crowd - simply find out the religious leaning of the hundreds of judges who have been confirmed.  Surely there are some fundies in the crowd.  And I suspect that not all of the judges being filibustered are fundamentalist, although I think most, if not all, of them are Christian.

        But the wingers will filter out the logical parts and leave with the take home lesson:  Democrats hate fundamentalist christians.  Dems will be pressured to stop their filibuster to appease the religious right (who would never vote for dems anyway).  Probably not the most brilliant move the republicans have come up with, but a good move nonetheless.  They get the fundies to start fighting the dems, distract America from their sleaziness, and come off as the party of God once again.  And maybe the fundies will get so excited by the judicial issues that they forget about the lack of an anti-Gay Marriage amendment and the fact that abortion is still legal.  

      •  Yes I hate that too (none)
        That now politics has come down to manipulating people's emotions rather that the discussion of issues. It is surely a sad time in America!
        The right wingers  are famous for manipulating the electorate's emotions. This election was a perfect example, they spoke to peoples' fears, prejudices,
        patriotism, and faith.

        Maybe we have to now appeal to the emotions of the electorate and show we are More PATRIOTIC because we believe in upholding and following the Law and the Constitution. Maybe we should appeal to peoples'
        faith by showing Democrats actually show their faith in action by supporting families in areas of their health, their schools, their jobs, their communities, etc.

        We choose hope over despair; possibilities over problems, optimism over cynicism.-John Edwards

        by wishingwell on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:23:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I think this is the message they want (4.00)
      to convey:

      Because of these filabusters, our  children will see the hatred America has for Christians, and will either decide to turn their back on Jesus or will stay out of government to serve the Lord.

      The fact that their imaginary persecution is taken seriously speaks loudly about this country's inability to separate fact from spin. Such delusions would be funny if they weren't mocking real persecution. No white Christian kid was ever lynched for wanting to become a judge.

      No doubt we will soon be hearing about the Christian holocaust.

    Not us.

    "Get your American flag out of your blind spot, bitch!"

    by KB on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:12:45 PM PDT

  •  Absolutely horrifying. (none)
    Dear God.
  •  Durbin spoke directly to that today in the Senate (none)
    and railed against the characterization of the filibuster as being used against religion.

    I often wish I had access to LexisNexis.

    Let the great world spin for ever down the ringing grooves of change. - Tennyson

    by bumblebums on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:13:08 PM PDT

    •  Durbin and Leahy will not like this one bit (4.00)
      If Frist speaks at this conference Leahy and Durbin will go bananas. They led the charges of religious bigotry over the William Pryor nomination:

      Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Ala.), a former U.S. attorney for whom Pryor once worked, ignited the firestorm over religion at last week's committee vote. "Can a person with orthodox Catholic views on abortion be affirmed as a federal judge? [Pryor's nomination] raises that question," he told The Hill yesterday.

      Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), the ranking member on the Judiciary Committee, and Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.), along with the Interfaith Alliance, a religious group, responded to allegations yesterday from Sessions and the Committee for Justice that they were guilty of anti-Catholic bias. "Religion is the last refuge of extremists," said Durbin, also a Judiciary Committee member, who challenged Sessions's allegations. "That hard questions about policy is some sort of criticism about religion has no place in the public marketplace," he said.

      Sessions disagreed, saying, "Bill Pryor has thought about abortion. His decision is consistent with Catholic doctrine." Sessions argued that because the Catholic Church's views on abortion are "mainstream," Democrats "should ask whether his personal views are so strong that he cannot uphold" the law.

      Durbin, who like Leahy is Catholic, said he and Leahy would propose a rule that "a witness or nominee cannot ever be asked about their religion." Leahy's remarks were more personal. He said that nothing in his 29-year political career had "angered and upset me as much as this ... to brand me as anti-Christian."

      Contact Leahy and Durbin if you are a constituent. This is bigotry masked in piety.

  •  Of course he should not have to choose (4.00)
    Nobody should have to choose. Anything. The Family Research Council should choos for them!


    •  your words inspire a prose Photoshop job: (none)
      Replace the gavel with the constitution and the flag. Add a crucifix, a sword, and hellfire flames to the hand holding the bible. Inscribe the bible, "Law of the Land."


      It's Frist, smiling for the camera:

      "America, you shouldn't have to choose."

      * * *  FRC official seal  * * *

      Family Research Council presents Injustice Sunday
      "We'll choose for you."

      OUR FAITH AGAINST YOUR DEMOCRACY--The Consititution protects your rights. We just hate that, and so does our God!


      Is nothing secular?

      by aitchdee on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 09:24:44 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Isn't this crap supposed to be televised? (none)
  •  Caption Contest (none)
    He Should Not Have to Choose!

    Selectively quote the Bible at 'merka's liberal enemies?

    or beat them to senseless with this gavel?

    Start doing the things you think should be done, and start being what you think society should become. -Adam Michnik.

    by GreenSooner on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:13:42 PM PDT

  •  What a small gavel (none)
    So, presumably these nominees who are being filibustered are promising to deliever a "Sudd-ern Bap-tist Ah-meri-cah" or something of that sort.

    Republicans, for being the party in control of the House, Senate, White House and so on.. they're their personal martyrs

    "Our country right or wrong. When right, to be kept right; when wrong, to be put right" - Carl Schurz

    by RBH on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:13:53 PM PDT

    •  Precisely my thoughts (4.00)
      tiny gavel!

      so so so bored at work, so...

      and believe me, they made tacky font choices.

      Sturm und Drang -- poking at culture's soft underbelly since 2005.

      by magpie02141 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:49:27 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Nice to see... (none)
        we have at least 3 photoshopper Kossacks.  Not exactly a vast left wing conspiracy, but we could still do some damage...
      •  I find it amusing that (none)
        the nominal head of this organization has the same name as a now-deceased actor who was widely believed to be gay.

        Not sure if he ever came out or not.

        There's a nice-ninny priest/at tea in everyone,/all cozy and chatty as auntie,/but a saint comes/and throws rocks through the window. -- John Ciardi

        by Mnemosyne on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:26:41 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Cross-dressing delusional psychotic wingnuts (none)
          (I find it amusing that) the nominal head of this organization has the same name as a now-deceased actor who was widely believed to be gay.

          LMAO ... I love that. Whenever he's spokesdoofing for Focus on the Family, I mentally add "because a boy's best friend is his mother."

          I imagine "Concerned Woman for America" Robert Knight is out there because he can't find a competent spokeswoman in the vast group. OR, the concerned ... women ... only ... exist in his mind ...

          This machine fights fascism - motto on Woody Guthrie's guitar

          by Peanut on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 08:37:32 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  HAHAHAHAA like Impact....... (none)
        and Comic Sans MS.  Sheesh.

        "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." - Cicero

        by KOWALSKI on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:57:46 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  That's not... (none)
          ... Comic Sans, it's Techno. Not much better, but still... and follow the link if you hate Comic Sans.

          Impact is still a useful font, though.


          by highacidity on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 04:21:09 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  actually (none)
            my closest match on my Mac system was something called Tekton.  And I had to stretch it out, yeesh!  But yes, the poster does a disservice to the usually respectable font Impact.

            Sturm und Drang -- poking at culture's soft underbelly since 2005.

            by magpie02141 on Sat Apr 16, 2005 at 05:41:50 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Now that I look on my font collection... (none)
              ... I have Tekton too, and it is the same font basically. I think Techno may be a knock-off of Adobe's Tekton font... Techno happened to be swiched on at the time. But I have soooo many fonts and it can be difficult to remember which ones came with the system (my main machine is a mac g5). Yes, I am a font geek. Glad you still appreciate Impact :-) And good work, BTW!

              Would there be any use for a dKos Photoshop Brigade? There could be enough of us to do some real damage!


              by highacidity on Sat Apr 16, 2005 at 11:13:05 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  Wow! (none)
            Talk about people with too much time on their hands!

            9/11 was the Neocons' Reichstag fire.

            by Bulldawg on Sat Apr 16, 2005 at 07:23:55 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Hey now! (none)
              Some of us spend a lot of time working with this stuff, and we get a little attached to the tools of our trade.

              Excuse me for leaking graphics geekiness onto a political blog :-)


              by highacidity on Sun Apr 17, 2005 at 12:37:56 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Well...OK then. (none)

                9/11 was the Neocons' Reichstag fire.

                by Bulldawg on Sun Apr 17, 2005 at 01:28:31 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  it's Ok, really, no offense taken (none)
                  You wouldn't believe how much down time I have at my job.  It's criminal.  It's one of those old-timey bureaucracies where everyone but me has been there forever, and none of them want things to change, ever.  

                  We're a govt non profit, so we're feasting off the shrinking tax dollar.  Makes me nauseous.  Will someone please hire me?  Please?  

                  Sturm und Drang -- poking at culture's soft underbelly since 2005.

                  by magpie02141 on Mon Apr 18, 2005 at 08:30:02 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

      •  Tiny gavels (none)
        Make me warm all over
        With a feelin' that
        I'm gonna love you till the end of time

        Hua li'i
        I ka waina
        Au hau'oli
        I ka wa au inu.....

        "If it once became general, wealth would confer no distinction." George Orwell

        by justme on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 07:12:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  This is child abuse. (4.00)
    Plain and simple. Frist and the FaRCing morons are using religion as an excuse YET AGAIN to seize power.

    He should not have to choose alright.. Public Service and faith in Christ should have NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER WHEN IT COMES TO THE GOVERNMENT. If he wants to join a faith-based service organization, go right ahead. Otherwise, you're putting your religion on this teenager's body, and saying it's a righteous cause.

    If Jesus saw this, he'd turn over your fucking table and throw you out of that megachurch you're planning to broadcast from.

    Joe Lieberman and Lincoln Chafee are on NOTICE - Rosa Delauro and Sheldon Whitehouse for Senate 2006!

    by Scoopster on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:14:07 PM PDT

  •  Isn't it a shame (4.00)
    how good Christians like Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton have been unable to participate in politics due to their political beliefs?

    If a wise man contendeth with a foolish man, whether he be angry or laugh, there will be no rest - Proverbs 29:9

    by Croatoan on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:14:23 PM PDT

  •  American Family Associations... (none)


    An Important Vote Coming Up On Judges
    "The Constitution Is What The Judges Say It Is." - Former Supreme Court Chief Justice Charles E. Hughes

    "Candidates With Deeply Held Christian Beliefs Are Unfit and Disqualified From Serving As A Federal Judge." - New York Senator Charles Schumer

    Dear Timothy,

    On May 1, 2004, in a Senate Judiciary Committee session, Senator Charles Schumer of New York said that J. Leon Holmes was disqualified as a candidate for a federal judge appointment because of his "deeply held conservative religious views."  Holmes is a Catholic.

    On June 11, speaking of Alabama Attorney General Bill Pryor, a nominee for the appellate court, Schumer said Pryor's beliefs "are so well known, so deeply held that it's hard to believe that they're not going to influence" his decisions.  Attorney General Pryor is a Catholic. Sen. Dianne Feinstein of California also opposed Pryor because of his "deeply held religious beliefs."

    Former Supreme Court Chief Justice Charles E. Hughes once said, "We live under a Constitution, but the Constitution is what the judges say it is."  In plain English, that means we don't live under a Constitution but under judges, some of which have total disregard for the intent of the Founding Fathers.

    Now, add to that the belief by Senate liberals that a devout Christian is automatically unfit and disqualified as a candidate for a federal judgeship.

    The ACLU, Planned Parenthood, People For The American Way, Americans United For Separation of Church and State and their allies in the Senate are ready to block--by filibuster--every judicial nominee who doesn't support their liberal agenda. People for the American Way alone has already raised $2,000,000 and has a "war room" in Washington staffed by 50 people.

    A vote to end their filibustering will soon be taken.  The vote will be to abide by the Constitution and require a simple majority of votes cast, or--as the liberals want-- to require 60 votes to end their filibuster. This will be the most important vote taken in this session of Congress.

    Don't let a minority of 40 Senators and their liberal, activist cohorts on the bench set the precedent that a devout Christian is unfit and automatically disqualified as a federal judge.

    Click here to send your emails!  One click sends your email to each of your Senators.



    Donald E. Wildmon, Founder and Chairman
    American Family Association

    P.S. Vitally important. Please forward this to your friends and family and alert them to the importance of this vote.


    A Gift For The Graduate - an attractive gift book in which AFA founder and Chairman Donald E. Wildmon offers practical, sensible advice for the graduate in a refreshing manner.  Click here for sample chapter.

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    •  Wow. (none)
      I want to ask them, "What if a judge was a devout Satanist? Would you want him hired then for the Supreme Court then?"

      Think they would get the point?

      "Think. It ain't illegal yet." - George Clinton

      by jbeach on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:18:15 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Can we have our identity back please? (none)
        Or a Judge with another religious belief?  They push so hard for things to be black and white, you are either grouped as a "Christian" or "not a Christian".  That is so far off base from Christian beliefs that is completely undermines Christianity as a whole.  They certainly did not learn this scare tactic from Jesus, perhaps they learned it from their 'leaders'.
  •  Justice Hunh? Day (none)
    Why would it be a teenage boy?  How is that relevant?  

    And when was the Bible Squeeze Tube invented?  I've never seen anyone hold a book like that.

  •  Hilarious! (4.00)
    Exactly how many Presidents have we had who were not self-described Christians?  Are they also public servants?  

    This ad really serves to denigrate (and hopefully, piss off) Christians in public service; the wedgers should become weedgees.

    "Never mind the trick, what the hell's the point?" Joseph Heller, Catch-22

    by wozzle on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:15:21 PM PDT

    •  also (4.00)
      how many children have been appointed to the federal bench?
    •  Thomas Jefferson comes to mind </eom> (none)
      •  Lincoln too (none)
        I once saw a table of the professed religions of all the Presidents to that point (I think it was during the Nixon era). The only one that didn't state a religious affiliation of any kind was Lincoln. (Be kind to me if I'm wrong. This was over 30 years ago and some of the details are a bit fuzzy, like in exactly which publication I saw this table.)

        I can't remember most of the rest of them so I don't know what they listed for Jefferson. Deist would probably have been a good guess. I remember hearing a guy who does Thomas Jefferson, in character, for middle- and high-school students saying something like "I'm not sure what religion, if any, Jefferson would have embraced. The closest I can come is that he probably regarded God as something of a divine Clockmaker, who set the universe in motion but then stood back to watch it run rather than take active part in it afterward."

  •  It's time (none)
    to round up all the fundies and lock them up. The f*cking don't deserve the freedom our country allows. Let's make it the Handmaid's Tale in reverse for these in-breeding stupid perverts.
  •  propaganda machine (4.00)
    Where is the big picture strategy to fight against the propaganda machine of the neocons? They are constantly firing off this sort of BS to their "base" and it works. Separation of Church and State is now a "radical" those damn rebel radicals, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, Alexander Hamilton... I'm tired of this crap being spewn out like this is 1938 Nazi Germany and no real counter attack that is organized is taken. They are controlling the country at this point with propaganda, which is a known technique and can be stopped with a strong strategic counterattack. Esp. on this sort of topic...they are trying to override the US founders' basic principles.
    •  I absolutely agree. (none)
      This should be news...and our response should be even bigger news.  We've got to light up the media with our responses to corrosive shit like this.
    •  You're right..but let's think endgame here. (4.00)
      First, you're right.  This is a well-designed and well-thought out rollout following Schiavo.  I would guess that it was supposed to roll out right after Schiavo, but was postponed because some were having second thoughts after seeing the polling.  It might also have been retooled a bit.

      However, since DeLay's "apology", it has been clear that the Rethugs are proceeding full steam ahead.

      What does this mean?

      (a) Frist WILL exercise the nuclear option.
      (b) The nuclear option is only the first step.
      (c) The second step, I believe, is DeLay's "re-structuring" of the judiciary.
      (d) This re-structuring will be sold as "justice" and "reform."
      (e) This re-structuring will shrink the size of the Supreme Court to 5 justices.  It will consolidate the 11 Circuit Courts to 3.  It will eradicate many District Courts, and will limit the jurisdiction of Federal Courts to hear only criminal cases and corporate disputes.
      (f) The net effect: total fucking chaos and destability.  A Constitutional crisis.
      (g) The Marshals will then begin mass arrests and roundups.    

      The important thing to realize here is that time is on the Rethugs side.  They can do all this crazy radical shit, and we have to wait for the courts to address it.  Yes, there will be court challenges to this.  But, just as with Guantanamo and the Hamdi and Padilla cases, they will take YEARS to resolve.  Meantime, the Rethugs power grab remains in effect.

      Remember, if you believe the worst, you must realize the kind of precedents the Rethugs were looking for with Hamdi and Padilla.  These are American citizens people.  YOUR government, the US of A, was arguing for the right to lock up ANYONE on the President's say-so at ANYTIME.  And, who repelled this attack on our liberty?  The Federal Courts.  Now, it's payback time.

      This is serious shit.  I do not think Dems (or many others) see this coming.  Yes, Reid is aware of the Religious Right, but no one thinks it is going to get this radical.  They are wrong.

      We need to formulate a plan to counter this NOW.  I think it needs to be a convention in a city.  It needs to happen NOW.  We need to get Kossacks together and to begin to do something, because no one is going to do it for us.  And it has to start NOW.

    •  Radicalise the middle (none)
      The solution is to form a "radical middle" which is what I think we are: the Dean/Clark types, the "lefty" blogosphere, which isn't lefty, really, it's what used to be called "mainstream America": moderate Democrats who want basic things like health care, decent jobs, control over our own bodies, choice in our destiny and government, equality, safe streets, healthy food/air/water, open space, normal stuff like that. These are middle-America, mainstream values... or they used to be anyway.

      We have to be strident and militant in pushing moderation. This is, I think, what Dean, and now Reid, Pelosi, and others, are doing, and they are doing it quite well.

      Remember, the Good Doctor was never, ever a lefty anyway. He was a very moderate, almost Clintonite governor. Clark was a General-- no Chomsky-quoting leftist there. But what the "reform Democrats" are, that Democrats weren't until Dean and others came along, is feisty, and ballsy, and willing to fight for sanity and common sense, becuase we have to. What I get from blogs like Dkos and TPM and OW is: "Democrats, stand up and be Democrats!".

      Because what we're fighting here are radical bat-shit crazy maniacs. I mean, just look at this flyer they put out. We can't sit back and be complacent, or be considerate and respectful of their views (because they damn sure ain't of ours!), and we can't appease them, or they'll squash us like bugs.

  •  As someone in a diary pointed out... (none)
    Yeah, LIKE the dozens of judges and other officials the Democrats VOTED TO CONFIRM recently were ALL freaking NON-Christians!

    When will the rightwing stupidity ever end?

    KISS -- Keep It Simple, Stupid! :-D

    by Viktor on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:16:46 PM PDT

  •  asdf (none)
    I think it's time the liberal/left wing UUs start speaking out loudly about our faith.

    the good we secure for ourselves is precarious and uncertain until it is secured for all of us and incorporated into our common life. -jane addams

    by bsmcneil on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:16:57 PM PDT

  •  Imagine the screaming ... (4.00)
    ...if that was a Koran.
  •  reality based, part n++ (4.00)
    The fact that this is a total non sequitur is irrelevant.

    If you don't support the nuclear option, you hate Christians. That's the logic of it. And the poor, sorry Christians start dancing the moment someone starts playing a tune for them.

    At the moment, i'm just feeling sorry for anyone actually taken in by this cheap rhetorical trick. It's so... transparent.  But i suppose this sort of thing is the logical conclusion (no pun intended) of right-wing anti-intellectualism.  Anyone decently educated and trained to think critically would spot the deception right away.  The GOP power elite needs the rubes to stay in power, and they need to keep the rubes ignorant and unthinking, or the rubes may catch on to the game.

    "There's nothing like poverty to get you into Heaven"
    -Patty Griffin, "Poor Man's House"

    by Leggy Starlitz on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:17:33 PM PDT

    •  Yes, exactly (none)
      If you don't support the nuclear option, you hate Christians.

      Yes, this is exactly the message they are tying to convey. That it is wrong doesn't matter -- their supporters won't listen to us because they don't even listen to us. Liberals to them are like The Jew image that was mainly created by Nazi propaganda.

      Sponge Bob, Mandrake, Cartoons. That's how your hard-core islamahomocommienazis work.

      by Benito on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:43:03 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I'm sick to my stomach (4.00)
    As a born-again Christian, I spit on that flyer.
    •  Perhaps you could (none)
      go to DC and protest?? With a sign that says, "BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN AGAINST BIGOTRY". If there were a crowd of born again Christians protesting these people and their ideas, that would make a much bigger impression on the media, and other Christians, than a bunch of "libruls" screaming about the Constitution.

      What happens when Bush takes Viagra? he gets taller. Robin Williams

      by Demfem on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:47:10 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Abraham Lincoln would be a Democrat today (4.00)
    The Republicans would never elect somebody who is known first for Honesty and who doesn't thump his bible.


    "Our country right or wrong. When right, to be kept right; when wrong, to be put right" - Carl Schurz

    by RBH on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:18:56 PM PDT

    •  Lincoln Presidentail Library (none)
      is being dedicated this weekend thru Tuessday, here in Springfield, ILL.  Good chance Bu$h, might be here, no confirmation yet.

      When the rest of the world decides to take care of the bully, I hope I'm not in Columbine.

      by georgeNOTw on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:41:05 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I may be off topic, but (none)
        I travelled through Springfield mid-March. Neat place... I was rather shocked to learn that the presidential library and presidential museum for Lincoln are just getting off the ground. I naively expected that someone such as Lincoln would already  have had those.

        I took a tour of the library and found it most fascinating. But the museum wasn't opening for a little while, I gathered (end of April, I think?)

    •  At frist I thought you wrote... (none)
      ....and who doesn't hump his bible
      which is really what these fvcktard's are doing anyway.
  •  Yup, He Shouldn't Have to Choose (none)
    Since the Constitution (remember that 'ol rag?) prohibits any religious test for public officials. So really, the kid can be any religion he wants to as long as it doesn't interfere with his judgely duties...y'know, when he gets appointed Chief Justice 35 years from now.

    What the hell this has to do with fillibusters is beyond me.

    It is time that Democrats understand that war has been declared and shots are being fired. It is time for Democrats to stand up.
    -Kos (slightly edited)

    by bramish on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:19:27 PM PDT

  •  Huh? (none)
    I totally do not get the image or the message. It looks to me like he's trying to decide between Habitat for Humanity and the ministry. But obviously, I'm not the intended audience.

    Looks like BushCo is really trying to play the "faith" card. Don't forget, not everyone that voted for Bush is a religious zealot! I wonder how many of those who supported him knew that they were actually voting to smash the separation between church and state? All they have to do is alienate a few of the voters who provided his slim margin of victory. This just might be the trick to do it ....

    First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. -- Mohandas Gandhi

    by trueblue illinois on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:19:33 PM PDT

    •  Text vs. Image (none)
      I understand the message in the text.  But I have no comprehension why they would use a kid.  What's the connection?  Since Democrats use the filibuster to disqualify Christian judges from the federal bench, this poor Christian boy will never grow up to fulfill his lifelong dream of becoming a judge?  Are we to believe that this is a common problem?

      (BTW, wouldn't it be better as a cap-and-gown wearing graduate?)

    •  decoding it for you (4.00)
      This is all about firing up the radical religious base. It's not about mainstream Republicans (much less the actual middle), and it's not about elected officials.  Politically, the actual nuclear vote boils down to gaming a handful of squeamish moderate Republican senators, and this sort of foaming-at-the-mouth radicalism is a turnoff for them.

      Right now, the GOP needs its stormtroopers more wound up than ever.  I'm pretty sure there are just two kinds of GOP politicians in Washington now... those who see the whole Bush era grinding to a brutal halt in 2006/2008 due to a combination of GOP overreaching and Democratic organization, and those who really believe they've achieved a permanent GOP majority - in other words, idiots. But either way, without keeping the Christian Taliban voters wound to the breaking point, they can't survive the 2006 elections. So it's going to be one thing like this after another for the next 2-4 years, at least, if not in perpetuity.

      So back to the point... again, this poster and the broadcast are aimed squarely at the zealots. The non-zealots aren't even supposed to know it's happening!  After all, there's a real danger there.  If the security moms and middle-class white men start seeing the GOP as controlled by the religious fanatics, and the Democrats start looking sober and responsible, they could turn into enough swing vote for massive Democratic victories in the near future.

      See, it's a sucky corner they've painted themselves into.  They have to keep the base fired up on "moral" non-issues constantly, while making their actual living situation worse and worse, without offending the middle who are still buying the "tough on terror" and "tax and spend" bullshit. Which is why i think the GOP game will be over soon... the Taliban is no more than 15% of the voting population.

      "There's nothing like poverty to get you into Heaven"
      -Patty Griffin, "Poor Man's House"

      by Leggy Starlitz on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:34:03 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Thanks for clarifying it for me (none)
        It's not that I'm dense; it's that their tactics seem so cartoonishly outrageous that I can't believe everyone else doesn't see right through them.

        Do you think the GOP's posturing during the Schiavo episode alerted many middle-of-the-road voters to their allegiance to the "Christian Taliban"? A lot of people were really turned off by that. I would think they'd be treading more carefully now ... instead, as you suggest, they're going for broke. They're playing with political fire right now (well, that's why it's called the "nuclear option," duh). If I didn't feel so invested in the outcome, this game of chicken might actually be entertaining to watch.

        First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. -- Mohandas Gandhi

        by trueblue illinois on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:46:34 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Schiavo (none)
          Yes, i think it hurt them.  I think a lot of mainstream voters who went for Bush rather than Kerry got their wake-up last month, and they're just beginning to be vaguely concerned that maybe the fundamentalists are slightly more influential than they thought.

          Meanwhile, the religious right is going into "What have you done for me lately?" mode, especially considering the lack of progress on gay rights, abortion, prayer in schools, or whatever the hot-button issue is. Basically, four years of Bush and long-term GOP control of Congress has given them NOTHING on their pet issues.  

          So the GOP has to stoke the fire some.  Schiavo was a miscalculation, one that actually made even a lot of religious conservatives squirm, much less non-fanatics and, well, everyone. Pretty much everyone outside of the hardcore religious base disagreed with them, and so did a good chunk of the religious base.  

          Pushing the nuclear option is a good way back out... the filibuster issue is arcane enough that Joe Sixpack doesn't give a shit, and they can play simple "If you're against the nuclear option you hate Christians" logic, going back to the whole whiny oppressed-minority game the modern religous right enjoys playing so much.  

          "There's nothing like poverty to get you into Heaven"
          -Patty Griffin, "Poor Man's House"

          by Leggy Starlitz on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:10:19 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Yes ... (none)
            You know, I don't see any way for them to win long-term with this. If they trash the filibuster, they've already infuriated the 49 percent who didn't vote for Bush, plus the moderate Bush voters who still count on the Dems to rein in the fanatical wing of the party. After that, there will be nothing holding them back from delivering on the far-right agenda. If they deliver, moderate Bush voters will be even more alienated, which doesn't bode well for the GOP down the road. If they don't deliver, the fanatics will be furious and could ultimately abandon the party. In a way, it was so much easier for them when they didn't control every branch of government. Now, there's no one to blame when they don't do what the far right tells them to do.

            I wish this were a really well-written political thriller instead of reality. It's gripping to watch the GOP lay all their cards out on the table like this. But there's too much at stake to find it entertaining.

            First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. -- Mohandas Gandhi

            by trueblue illinois on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:56:05 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  yes (none)
        Which is why i think the GOP game will be over soon... the Taliban is no more than 15% of the voting population.

        God I hope you're right.  Your analysis otherwise was dead on, I feel.

        •  forgive me but I'm pretty sure their percentage (none)
          of the voting population is irrelevant. They're Dominionists. That means they're thoroughly anti-democratic. Together with Dobson, Falwell, Robertson, Kennedy, Colson, et. al., and a half dozen super rich Christian businessmen, they've been planning this overthrow for 25 years. If they submit to the rule of law--if they're voted out and just accept that and go home--they'll have turned their back on God. Every day they tell themselves and each other and all their unwashed minions that to (re)Christianize this nation they must stop at nothing. The country is "out of alignment with God," has lost God's protection, and it's their reason for being to get their frightened butts back under that holy protective mantle again. Jesus will come back to rule and reign for a thousand years (and they'll be righteous Regents rulin' and reignin' at his side) but only after they get this Christian Nation job done here (and then around the world). The Bible says they have to prepare His Kingdom on earth or He won't come. That means they won't get Raptured. They might even go to hell. If you understand what's at stake for these people if they fail--I mean, forget that: they can't fail. They're VIPs in the final cosmic drama between God and Satan, light and dark, good and evil; it's the End of Days; it's do or die. They won't be sidelined. How could they be? God's on their side. They stake their life on it. It cannot go wrong.

          So I think we're going to see some lawlessness. I think that might be putting it mildly. I don't know any fundamentalists  who have the least intention of retreating. A cocksure, "let's roll" mentality is afoot in this community. Their preachers are encouraging it, fomenting it, rattling sabers. Ultimately fundies have no use for elections, constitutions, "man's law." It's all cursed, putrid, "adamic" (of the fallen Adam). This business of voting is a prize human evil they've set their jaw to abolish; it's just so much "leaning unto thine own understanding," voting. Uppity humans. Don't you know it's God you're to lean unto (as interpreted by them)?

          So I don't know at what point the fundies, however few in number relative to the rest of us, will decide submit to mere mortal authority (say, sworn election results). I really don't see that happening. Every obstacle is seen as another test of faith; pushing past it, another gain in glory. Things aren't going your way? Don't judge God by man. God can do anything and as his handmaiden, so can you. Override. Adam's laws don't apply to you.

          Is nothing secular?

          by aitchdee on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 11:39:49 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  "The Base" (none)
        I'm not sure what meanings you and Kos intended when you call these people the American Taliban, or the Christian Taliban, but this highlights one of many parallels.  Bush frequently calls his supporters The Base.  And as many sites, including dKosopedia report, The Base translates to Al Qaeda.

        So while I wish the dialog didn't fall to such attacks, in this case, I can't say that it's inappropriate.

    •  I don't see it. (none)
      I think we underestimate the sheer numbers of Americans who believe this stuff. We're the minority, remember. I don't have the stats but somebody know 'em?

      A society of sheep must beget in time a government of wolves. Bertrand de Jouvenel

      by Little Red Hen on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:40:10 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Heh ... I thought the gavel was a screwdriver! (none)
      Yes, at first glance I thought he was holding a hand tool. Hence the "Habitat for Humanity" reference.

      I still think the image is pretty dumb. He has a completely befuddled look on his face, as if he doesn't know what either item is used for!

      But as I said, I'm obviously not the intended audience.

      First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. -- Mohandas Gandhi

      by trueblue illinois on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:54:29 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  An unintended irony... (4.00)
    Since public service in the Bush era means starting unjust wars, screwing the poor, torturing and executing prisoners, and demonizing anyone who is to the left of Franco, faith in Christ may indeed be incompatible with "public service."

    Somehow I don't think that's what they had in mind, though.

  •  Fark it (none)
    anyone who has the time (just a quick check in for me unfortunately- jeez- you'd think they were paying me to actually work or something)

    wanna submit this to as a photoshop contest to see what they come up with?

    Bush will be impeached.

    by jgkojak on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:20:00 PM PDT

  •  frames? Schaivo? (none)
    so they've got their frame: "assault on religion/Christianity," what's ours?  I don't really think that "upholding Senate traditions" or "protecting the minority voice" are particular winners.  I think that linking it to the Schaivo case and the issues around that case are good approaches, but I'm not sure the right way to put it.
    •  Render unto Caesatr what is Caesar's. (4.00)
      Jesus never preached, to my knowledge, that we should overthrow the government.  Maybe I read some wimpy liberal Bible, though, that didn't have Judge-killing Jesus in it.
    •  Our Frame (4.00)
      "Do you really want to let the same bunch of zealots who stuck their noses into the Terri Schiavo case to have free rein in picking judges -- who serve for life?"
      •  Simpler frame (none)
        In America no one has to chose between civil service and servie to god.

        Secondary message:
        Only in a country run by single-minded fanatics, like the Talaban in Afghanistan who attacked out nation, do you have to chose.

    •  Simple -- (4.00)
      sincere, RIGHTEOUS (no pun intended, since I do mean rightous) anger:  "How DARE they make such bizarre allegations? I can't believe they can even keep a straight face!"

      No fancy words, no "frames" -- just the truth.

      •  wherever you stand on frames (none)
        I think even if you don't buy the arguments in favor of framing for the general populace, how we frame an issue is important for how the media will talk about it.  much of the media will report on an issue in a he said/she said manner--other parts of the media will present the story in the way that they think is "sexiest."  the GOP is great at presenting spoon-fed frames for reporters.  when presented with the GOP saying that Dems are anti-Christian and the Dems saying "what? that's just stupid", they'll run with "is the Democratic Party anti-Christian"--it's well suited for talking heads shows and lazy reporters.  we have to present an alternative package for a lazy reporter.
    •  anti-American (none)
      They paint us as "against people of faith".
      We paint them as against America.

      Among the founding principles of our (great) nation is the balance of powers.  Attacking the filibuster is akin to attacking core American principles.

      In fact, I think we should use this on many issues.

      America is about equal rights ("all men are created equal"), about opportunities for even the most downtrodden ("Give me your poor..."), about common sense and responsibility (suggestions for an easily recognized quote?).  
      All of this is what made and makes our country great.

      They invoke the cross.  We should invoke the flag.  
      Anti-gay legislation is anti-American.  
      Rewarding wealth over work is anti-American.
      Rising deficits and ruining the earth are anti-American.
      Destroying the balance of powers is anti-American.

      •  play the nationalism card! (none)
        this is how the right does it -- they paint the liberal as being UnAmerican. I say we paint them as being unamerican right back.

        Sponge Bob, Mandrake, Cartoons. That's how your hard-core islamahomocommienazis work.

        by Benito on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:49:32 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Does this not carry the intended message? (4.00)
    To me, it looks an awful lot like, "Choose now: the laws of the land or the Bible!"
  •  Nobody expects an (4.00)
    inquisition. I'm looking forward to the book burnings and the witch's burning at the stake. After that we can go back to our roots. Do you think Newt will mind wearing a scarlet A.
  •  Anyone see Durbin's Senate speech today? (4.00)
    He was on a roll! He talked about the nuclear option and the story in today's NY Times about Frist and the theocons holding "Justice Sunday."

    It was good stuff.

  •  counterprotest? (4.00)
    Freedom AND Justice Sunday

    and a poster with a bunch of people saying

    "We should not have to believe in Christianity to be considered people of faith"

    "....a relative newbie (user ID in the 18,000 range).. "

    by Miss Devore on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:23:45 PM PDT

  •  the time (none)
    It's a weird time isn't it?  7 pm?

    Anoyone know how many people they expect?

    Freedom begins between the ears. ~americanEntropy~

    by hfiend on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:24:35 PM PDT

  •  Gosh, (none)
    I wonder what Frist and Dobson talked about when they had their religious heritage tour of the capitol???

    Could they have been planning this event while Frist was on comp'ny time?

    Seattle Kossack Meetup
    Brown is the suede which mows the harvest.

    by switzerblog on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:25:10 PM PDT

  •  Do You Feel Nuclear, Punk? (4.00)
    Here's my
    post from this morning.

    The flyers have already gone out, but our side needs to get the word out across the sphere on this.


  •  Looks like I married a transexual (4.00)
    Join REAL Women to Champion Human Life on April 27!     spacer
    Thursday, April 14, 2005:

    Find & Contact
    Elected Officials   

    REAL Women's Voices is a national pro-life women's lobbying day in Washington, D.C. on Wednesday, April 27. This historic day gives REAL women, pro-life women, an opportunity to make their voices heard across America!

    My wife's pro choice. I never had a clue that she wasn't a "real woman."

  •  Horrible photoshop job. (none)
    Look at the bible in his hand. Unless this kid has a seven inch thumb, this thing was photoshopped. Now, why would you have to photoshop a bible into a kid's hand? Seems easy enough to just snap a picture and be done with it.

    Any thoughts?


  •  The reply should be... (4.00)
    A similar picture with the caption:

    Freedom Or Theocracy
    Attack on American Freedoms -- A handful of fundamentalists want to change this country from a democracy to an American Taliban state.

    What will you choose?

    •  Even simpler (none)
      Constitution or soft coup.

      That's what is at stake here; these anticonstitutionalists have been scheming on a method of doing away with much of the Constitution since the Bush Crime Family took office.

      Thus, the real is, "do you want to respect the Constitution, or are you an extremist who wants to tear our entire system of government to shreds."

    •  Yes, and we can use Randall Terry to show it. (4.00)
      "I want you to just let a wave of intolerance wash over you... I want you to let a wave of hatred wash over you. Yes, hate is good... Our goal is a Christian nation. We have a biblical duty, we are called by God, to conquer this country. We don't want equal time. We don't want pluralism."


      ..."You better believe that I want to build a Christian nation," Terry
      said, "because the only option is a pagan nation. Not that the government can make someone a Cristian by decree. A Christian nation would be
      defined as 'We acknowledge God in our body politic, in our communities, that the God of the Bible is our God, and, we acknowledge that His law is supreme."


      "When I, or people like me, are running the country, you'd better flee, because we will find you, we will try you, and we'll execute you. I mean every word of it." He added, "I will make it part of my mission to see to it that they are tried and executed."  "


      This is how we scare the shit out of the moderate and Liberatarian Republicans. They didn't mind using the wingnuts to get elected but they never signed on for this.

  •  "It will get out of control." (4.00)
    "It will get out of control, and we will be lucky to survive it."

    When I look at that poster ... I have a feeling that we're seeing the opening moves of the Second Civil War.

    Five years, tops, before the shooting starts.

    And God help us all.

  •  That guy is enormous (none)
    Looking at the sizes of the Bible and gavel in that kid's hands, he must be well over 8 feet tall.
  •  Happy now, America? (4.00)
    Is this what you wanted?

    The fucking crusades?

    Are you happy now?

    Jesus H. Fucking Christ.


    I did not receive $ from Ketchum, U.S. Department of Ed or HHS to write this---though I wish I had.

    by Volvo Liberal on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:33:10 PM PDT

  •  Omigawd?!@? (4.00)
    This is a war.

    No 2 ways about it.

    "Just say no to torture." -Semi-Anonymous Blogger.

    by Armando on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:33:24 PM PDT

  •  isn't one of the blessed commandments (4.00)
    ...keeping the sabbath holy?  this is anything but holy.  a rally?  for political reasons?

    reminds me of the parable of the man who prayed aloud in the middle of the temple, and the other man who prayed quietly, and how god smote the first guy for flaunting his faith.

  •  Prayer vigil, please! (4.00)
    Quick...organize a prayer vigil outside of the event. These people wouldn't know whether or not to join in or go into the conference.

    I would love to see that on the news!

  •  There is (4.00)
    no profanity strong enough to express my contempt for these people and my outrage at what they're trying to do to this nation and world.  Having said that:

    goddamnedmotherfuckingsonsof bitches

    Some of us have been watching and fighting these ass holes for years.  Some are finally starting to take notice.  I hope it's not too late.  I fear it may be.

    Just wait until the Drambuie and sleeping pills kick in.

    by MAJeff on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:34:49 PM PDT

  •  I'm hoping they do destroy the filibuster.... (none)
    ...and hasten the destructive path they are driving this country towards, so that in 2006 Democrats will take back the Congress and have debate-free initiatives like enivronmental justice, economic justice, judges, the whole lot...

    How much damge first though?

    •  That just silly talk (none)
      because the neo-con ultra-right-wing nut jobs can wreak a lot of havoc for years to come by placing their advocate judges on the national and Supreme benches.  This is trench warfare, and if we surrender this to them, we might as well fill out our emmigration papers.

      With just a few more judges like Roy Moore plugged into the Judiciary for life, not only will we see the immediate reversal of Roe v. Wade, but also more laws to legislate what goes on in the privacy of our own homes (think anti-gay legislation, legal enforcement of abstinancy pledges, reversal of equal protections against all forms of discrimination, etc.).

      This truly is aptly named the "nuclear" option, because the removal of the filibuster rule will hasten the Armageddon of the American Experiment in Democracy.

      Where are we going, and why are we going there in a hand-basket?

      •  Actually, if it is found that a judge (none)
        decided a case based on his faith rather than the law, he can be impeached and tossed unceremoniously off the bench.

        What happens when Bush takes Viagra? he gets taller. Robin Williams

        by Demfem on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:04:53 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  that's an incredibly unrealistic and naiive view (none)
          I don't know how you think someone would go about finding out that a judge ruled on faith rather than law.  In writing an opinion, the judge would cite legal precedent regardless of how the decision came out.  The most you could ever say about a judge's decision is that the judge got the underlying law wrong; there's not going to be any tangible evidence upon which you're going to pin a faith-based charge like that.

          I also really don't think that you want to get into the impeachment business.  A handful of judges have been impeached in this nation's entire history, and if politicians were going to begin impeaching judges for decisions they didn't like as a matter of course, then you're going to start breaking down the separation of powers and politicize judicial opinionmaking moreso than it is now.  Can you imagine if the Republicans started impeaching Democratically-appointed judges because the decisions were too "liberal"?  That is a path we don't want to go down.

          •  That was basically my point.. (none)
            that if a judge makes a decision and does it based on faith rather than law, then he can be impeached. If he cites legal precedent, then it stands to reason that he may have made the decision based on the law, rather than his faith. And as I am sure you know, in this country, we do give benefit of the doubt..reasonable reaching verdicts. Unless he cites the Ten Commandments, or a Biblical law, then he should be safe from impeachment for basing decisions on faith.

            What happens when Bush takes Viagra? he gets taller. Robin Williams

            by Demfem on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 06:49:51 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  What makes you think... (3.50)
      ...there will be elections in 2006?
  •  A must read (none)
    about DELAy and Religious Wack jobs

    Friday, April 15, 2005
    DeLay Speaks: More Red Meat For The Nation's Court-Haters
    I had to put this up it goes to the heart of the problem facing our country. People are so emotional over their religious veiws that the country be damned. They have no idea the road they are trying to take the country down will take the country down. By removing a system of checks and balances the "court haters" while most have good intentions they do not realize where the road they are paving leads.
    April 14, 2005
    Whose interpretation of the First Amendment do you believe - Tom DeLay or Tom Jefferson?
    Yesterday, on the 262nd anniversary of Jefferson's birthday, U.S. House Majority Leader DeLay, in an interview with The Washington Times, maintained that the separation of church and state is "nowhere in the Constitution...."

    There is more of the story at Truth Be Told

    Iraq= We will be there as long as there is fighting and there will be fighting as long as we are there.

    by rrob1 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:35:06 PM PDT

  •  So the ghoulish Dr. Frist (none)
    is the ghost of Ayatollah Khomeni after all.

    Frist, bin Laden and DeLay win, America loses.

    Defeat the sound-bite.

    by sbj on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:35:43 PM PDT

  •  American Taliban, AmericanTaliban, American Taliba (none)
    American Taliban
    American Taliban
    American Taliban

    Start saying it now, saying it often, and making it stick.  They WILL pull this off if we just sit around snarking to each other.  Then we can have diaries complaining about how they managed to pull it off.

    OR we can let this be the rope that we use to get 'em.  Start screaming about how un-American this is.  How this is just an attempt to tear down our democracy.  These are the American Taliban.

    What has the Democratic response been so far?  And we can't expect the Democratic Party to fight every battle.  The RNC isn't doing this, their letting FRC wage this battle while they prepare for 2006.

    •  Yup (none)
      And not be shy about it.  Take a page from their playbook and use 9/11.  What happens when fundamentalists take over the government?  What kind of people believe their brand of religion trumps every law?

      And link it to the specific issue, the whacko judges.  Picture of women in burkas, quotation from the judge who believes women should be submissive to men.  The Taliban attack us again--only this time, they run the Republican Party

  •  he should not have to choose (4.00)
  •  Let's Call There Bluff For Once: YES. CHOOSE. (4.00)
    Your faith is not for your job in public service. You are there to serve the public, and if that conflicts with the way you must practive your religion, than stay out of public service, period.

    That is the only true and rational All-American, Democratic, time-honored response. It's time to agree that IT IS indeed ON. Because once we do that, when we start talking sense, straight and boldly, and refuse to debate on their twisted terms, we blow them out of the water.

    Nobody, but nobody, wants the IRS deciding who to audit based on what church they belong to, or the Cops deciding to let off the pastor for a heinous crime, or merely drunken driving. There are a million ways faith must obviously remain out of the public sphere. Reminding people that, even among evangelicals, their are bitter splits and animosity, is one way to do that. We have a public square where religion has a limited role. Public stewards of that square have no more business practicing their religion on the job than a Santeria worshipper does performing a live chicken sacrifice in the deep fryer at McDonalds.

  •  OK, I'm sorry but (4.00)
    This is absolutely fracking ridiculous! What in the hell is going on in that country of yours?

    This is like some warped fiction novel instead of reality.

    I feel fot you normal folk down there, I really do. Cause trying to stop this kind of radical, religously-inspired train is almost impossible. It picks up steam every time someone is faced with the "threat" of going to hell.

    Mixing religion and politics is pure, pure evil. I'm sorry, but that's the truth.

    This is bad for the US, very, very bad....

    Canadians care too...

    by jbalazs on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:36:20 PM PDT

  •  Interesting visual codings in the picture (4.00)
    the kid's hair is moussed, he's wearing a maroon polo shirt, with a white under shirt. This thing is rendolent with culture/class meassages to their constituency. The Maroon color is a conservative heartland color, especially with a polo shirt, this says upper middle class all the way. Combined with the white t-shirt under it it says red state high humidity clean cut upper-middle class consumer. Zoned right toward their subconscious self image. He'd look good at the country club or the mall. "Such a nice young man!"

    Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it. - Mark Twain

    by Rolfyboy6 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:36:23 PM PDT

  •  What is the basis of the claim (none)
    that the filibuster was used to "protect racial bias"...?


    Mitch Gore

    Nobody will change America for you, you have to work to make it happen

    by Lestatdelc on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:40:21 PM PDT

  •  None of us should have to choose... (none)
    Having a fully functioning brain?

    Faith in Christ?

    Too bad the bible doesn't have as much to say about false dichotomies as it does about false idols.  Of course, this whole campaign comes under the heading of "false witness."

    Hey, maybe that's the counter campaign.  Maybe we need to flood Frist's office with letters consisting entirely of that particular commandment.

    And then there's the clear but unstated message of this image  that no white male should have to face such a terrible dilemna...

    "...your grasp has exceded your reach/ And you put all your faith in a figure of speech..." -- Warren Zevon

    by Roddy McCorley on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:41:47 PM PDT

    •  But what the Bible does say is very clear (none)
      "And whenever you pray, do not be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, so that they may be seen by others.  Truly I tell you, they have received their reward.  But whenever you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you." (Matthew 6:5-6)  

        "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!  For you cross sea and land to make a single convert, and you make the new convert twice as much a child of hell as yourselves." (Matthew 23:15)  

        "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!  For you tithe (donate) mint, dill, and cumin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law:  justice and mercy and faith.  It is these you ought to have practiced without neglecting the others." (Matthew 23:23)  

        "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!  For you clean the outside of the cup and of the plate, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence.  You blind Pharisee!  First clean the inside of the cup, so that the outside also may become clean." (Matthew 23:25-26)  

        "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!  For you are like whitewashed tombs, which on the outside look beautiful, but inside they are full of the bones of the dead and of all kinds of filth.  So you also on the outside look righteous to others, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness." (Matthew 23:27-28)  

        "But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!  For you lock people out of the kingdom of heaven.  For you do not go in yourselves, and when others are going in, you stop them." (Matthew 23:13-14)  

      Dominiosists = American Taliban

      Religious Right / Evangelicals  = Pharisees

      Jesus hated only one group -- the Pharisees = Jesus would preach AGAINST the Religious Right / Evangelicals

    •  THOU SHALT NOT (none)

      Wow -- this is absolutely the right tack to take on this ad head-on.    This enterprise should be condemned in the strongest religious terms by whoever can be heard as a spokesperson  - preferably a Christian or Jewish Democrat.

  •  Need an Iraqi kid... (4.00)
    With a gun in one hand and a book in the other.  "He should not have to choose..." but because of GWB, he does.
  •  we need to quash this nonsense (none)
    Justice For People Of Faith, So Long As You Are Of The Right Faith.

    Ironic personal moment...I have decided to go Berlin for the get away from this neo-Facism.

    •  Exactly (none)
      Notice the choice is between "public service" or "faith in Christ" and below it says "people of faith."  What if they are of another faith?  The message is clear, they are trying to make America a one religion state ahem Afghanistan ahem

      "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." - Cicero

      by KOWALSKI on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:02:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Good God people (none)
    Its a freaking internet banner.  Its about filibusters, this is not the shot heard round the world.

    There will not be blood in the streets over filibusters, and no matter how hard they try the religious right cannot get their agenda passed.

    Bush will be out of office in a few years, and a Democrat President is almost a sure bet so long as somebody with a real message runs.

    Over reaction helps nothing.

    •  Except (none)
      this is part of a general theme and is supported by several politicians.  If ignored totally it will not go away.

      OTOH, since the American public is, according to polls, against the ending of the filibuster rule, this may end up being overreaching on their part, which I hope it is.

      Bush, so incompetent, he can't even do the wrong things right.

      by JAPA21 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:48:19 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  wake up (none)
      They don't need to get their agenda passed if they appoint radical judges to the bench, who then work covertly to undermine any future progressive agenda for the next 30 or 40 years.  People really need to start giving a damn who is appointed to serve as federal judges in this country - it should have been an important election issue, but was buried under other important questions, like "did Kerry call Dick Cheney's daughter gay?" and other such pressing matters.  

      When Clinton was IN office, a high percentage of his judges were killed in committee, before they were ever put up for a vote.  Here's a question: how do you control a third branch of government with low turnover and lifetime tenure, assuming that a rival power will control one or more of the political branches in the future?  Answer: do everything you can to prevent that party's nominees from filling the bench, then ram all of yours through when you have control of the political branches.  Wash, rinse, repeat.  Depriving Democrats of the right to appoint their nominees and then appointing all the Republican nominees = Republican-controlled judiciary.

    •  his judges won't be (none)
      >>Bush will be out of office in a few years...

      and his agenda has advanced enough already to suck the air out of my universe.

      An 80% consensus on Sciavo, and they proclaim this is the will of the fucking people?

      This aggression will not stand, man.  

      Comments referring only to ratings are a nuisance. Noise. They waste time and bandwidth. We're all dumber for having read them.

      by willowby on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:15:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's a shot across the bow . .. (4.00)
      of Constitutional liberties.  This is the battleground upon which the enemy has chosen to fight and if the battle is not won, we will be well on our way to the death of the separation of church and state.  Call it exageration if you will.  I call it a moment of profound importance to the future of the Republic.

      It's the RULE OF LAW, stupid!

      by Rick Oliver on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:08:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's not just about filibusters (none)
      This is about this message that all Democrats are anti-Christian god-haters who want to conduct pagan sacrifices of aborted fetuses on the White House lawn, all while "shoving the gay lifestyle down their throats."

      It is a message of fear, hatred and discrimination that is keeping people like Frist in power and that impression of Democrats just keeps spreading. We are fighting to contain that message and demonstrate tolerance among all Americans, while maintaining the governmental structure based on our Constitution and not the Bible (or any other religious document).

      Signature goes here.

      by lalawguy on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 04:02:39 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  There already has been blood in the streets (none)
      There will not be blood in the streets over filibusters, and no matter how hard they try the religious right cannot get their agenda passed.

      The blood of doctors, the blood of clinic workers, the blood of relatives of a judge.

      Complacency does not help.  The end of filibusters and the packing of the bench will mean that a Democratic president will face activist judges who have passed a political litmus test.  And that will have been their only qualification.

      The fact that Frist is framing this as a religious issue means that if he wins, he can claim that Republicans now have the mandate to make America a "Christian nation."

      The revolution starts now--in your own back yard, in your own home town

      by TarheelDem on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 06:14:55 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  As a person of faith (4.00)
    I totally resent the poster and the thinking behind it.

    Since when is filibustering a person who disobeys the law to keep him from becoming a judge an attack on me?

    Since when is filibustering a judge who believes the world and its resources should be raped for private gain instead of being stewarded as the Bible calls us to an attack on me?

    Since when is filibustering a judge who believes taking care of the poor is socialism an attack on me?

    To me, and my faith, the filibuster is actually a protection of  both, not an attack on me.

    I resent that they feel that they are speaking for me.

    Bush, so incompetent, he can't even do the wrong things right.

    by JAPA21 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:45:40 PM PDT

  •  Potential slogans: The stakes are high ... (none)
    ... cause the Republican National Faith has lots of heathens to burn.

    I don't belong to Frist's particular sect so I guess I don't have  a prayer of getting a fair trial either.

    This machine fights fascism - motto on Woody Guthrie's guitar

    by Peanut on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:46:22 PM PDT

  •  Potentially stupid question (none)
    Why not just filibuster the anti-filibuster bill?
  •  another thought (none)
    I hate being the opposition party.  This sucks not controlling any part of the government...we just play defense all day.  sigh
  •  holy crap (none)

    i can't take much more of this, i'm half insane from these Krazies for Khrist already...

    they won't be "happy" until the whole government, education, medical care--EVERYTHING--is torn down & replaced by their Talibanesque parodies, and everyone who can read past the 3rd grade level and/or actually use reasoning skills of any kind has been locked up in some kind of slave-labor prison for heretics...

    i can see the "faith test" for their kops on the streets now: "Sir! If I drop this glass on the pavement, and it shatters--will that be because, A--gravity is real, or B--God wishes it to break?" "You think 'A'? Really? Well that's too bad, son--let's get you into the wagon, I'm afraid we have to take you in for Faithlessness."

    and then, having no more interal "enemies", they will fall upon each other at last.

    are Dobson & Frist frickin' ORCS or am i missing something?



  •  How dare the Democrats (none)
    fillibuster the very judges who could bring God into our lives!  

    Because if Judges don't bring God into our lives by forcing him/her/it upon us, then how will we ever come to know God.  

    This is a necessary part of the process of becoming godlier.  Don't fight it.  Don't fight religious tyranny , just lay back and enjoy it.

    Didn't the founders of this country come here and found the country because their rulers were so bland and boring that they couldn't stand not having religion forced upon them?  They came to this country seeking the security of religious zealots pressing religion upon them.  It felt good.

    At least that is what I read in the preview of the new 2006-2007 textbooks being ordered for our public school.

  •  Is that a Bible or some book? (none)
    Is that really a Bible? If it is which one? If it's a King James then it's the protestant bible of the heretic Martin Luther. Just saw the program on PBS about the sea battle between the British and Spain. Spain launched the Armada to punish Britain for it's heretical beliefs after it broke with the Roman Catholic church.

    These Evangelical  Christens if you ask them don't even know the history behind each of the different versions of the Bible. They read Bibles that are not sanctioned Bibles by Rome. The ones they do read have been gone over by the revisionist and whole sections and in some gospels have been edited out. Every pro-lifer Bible that We have seen when We were videotaping the abortion protest in Milwaukee had written in the margins about UFO's and some of the most totally whacked out stuff We've ever seen.

    That "Bible" looks more like some battered book that was pulled off the shelf. It's probably not even a Bible just some book.

    "We drew the line in the sand, and like the fools they are, they stepped into the abyss." HMSJO

    by hmsjo on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:51:23 PM PDT

      •  Can't Tell (none)
        We put it into Our imaging program and tried to read the letters on the spine of the book and none of the characters seemed to be part of the word bible. Beside most Bibles have on the Spine the words "The Holy Bible" and this is also repeated on the front cover. Notice there is only one line of text on the cover where you be able to see Holy on the top line and Bible on the Bottom line.

        Still looks like a book that was all beat up and would look good in the picture.

        They should have picked a better looking Bible that left no doubt it was a Bible. This might be how to get the poster off the market.

        Headline: Fake Bible photoshopped and used in picture.

        "We drew the line in the sand, and like the fools they are, they stepped into the abyss." HMSJO

        by hmsjo on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:11:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  The Bobble (none)
      is the werd ov Gawd.  It's jes that some parts of the werd is more 'potent than others!

      9/11 was the Neocons' Reichstag fire.

      by Bulldawg on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:01:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Original Biblical Text (none)
      Presumably to read the biblical texts in the most authentic form you would need to be a formidable scholar who knew Hebrew, Aramaic and Classical Greek. I doubt there are many people like that in the ranks of the Elect of God (Disneyland Chapter). Subtle theology is not their strong point.

      However I am sure that Protestant Evangelicals would not care that the Roman Catholics do not approve their version of the bible.

      In any event God demonstrated his Protestantism by sending storms to drive the Armada away, thus saving England. 16th century English Protestants believed that anyway.

      There is no man alive who is sufficiently good to rule the life of the man next door to him. Sir Rhys Hopkin Morris, M.P.

      by Gary J on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:22:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Right about reading the Bible. (none)
        You are right about reading the Bible. We've pointed out to many of the saved that in order to read the orginal text they need roughly in the area of 8 PHD's in such subjects.

        In every battle to date the "god's" have always been on all sides no matter who would win or lose.

        "We drew the line in the sand, and like the fools they are, they stepped into the abyss." HMSJO

        by hmsjo on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 10:30:24 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  And again, I ask (4.00)
    Where are the Democrats?


    They are being handed the keys to the 110th Congress (the one elected in 2006) and maybe even the White House itself, with this outrageous attack on the fundamental principles of American democracy.

    If they don't begin raising holy hell over this on the Sunday talk shows and then spend that entire week dropping everything else and attacking the GOP over this blatant act of theocracy, I will bolt this party and have nothing to do with it ever again. I am really starting to get angry - you can see it in my prose - with the silence of the Dems on this. I've had it about up to here (envision my hand at eye level) with their lack of action.

    One more, week, Dems. One more week to prove that you still have a pulse.

    I'm not part of a redneck agenda - Green Day

    by eugene on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:56:11 PM PDT

    •  Yes, yes yes. IF the Dem party does not unite (none)
      now, it's over...
      •  So sadly true (none)
        And we need to keep in mind that there are two battles: the legislative battle on the Senate floor over the filibuster, and the public battle over the place of religion in politics, in the judiciary, over the independence of the judiciary. My concern isn't so much that Dems will not stand and fight the nuclear option. It's instead that they will do only that, and will neglect the need to build a massive public wave of support for their position and against GOP theocracy. And, in the end, it's that public battle that matters a great deal more than the vote on the nuclear option.

        I'm not part of a redneck agenda - Green Day

        by eugene on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:04:32 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I wanna know - where are the progressives on this? (none)
      Conservative nutjobs get together and buy ads.

      Why haven't progressives gotten together, and bought big page ads about this American Taliban crap?

      Even now we should. It's reacting, and I'd rather be first, but it's important to get any part of our side into this public display.

      Is anyone doing this? Or are we waiting for the Democrats to save us? And getting mad that they aren't acting, when we haven't shown them our real interest and support?

      "Think. It ain't illegal yet." - George Clinton

      by jbeach on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:18:58 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  They're not fucking silent! (3.50)
      JEsus, read the news.  Durbin has been going on about this shit for days now.
      •  Oh, he has? (none)
        Well, it's not working.

        I'm going to be extremely demanding with the Dems here; the bar is set high. Until the Democrats' reaction is leading the news programs and above the fold on the newsracks, I will not be satisfied.

        My criticism isn't that the Dems are saying nothing. It's that their efforts to articulate their message have been weak and ineffectual. They need to turn up the volume - all the way to 11.

        I'm not part of a redneck agenda - Green Day

        by eugene on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:34:38 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  New Lexicon (none)
    Religious wingnut Republicans = American Taliban.
    Religious wingnuts who threaten violence = Christian Terrorists.

    This is terminology that we need to use in fighting this war. We allowed them to demonize the word "liberal" over the years. It's time to start fighting back with words as well as deeds

    "Everything that rises must converge"

    by jpgod on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:57:31 PM PDT

  •  Photoshop it (none)
    so that he has a copy of Playboy in one hand, and a condom in another.  Appropriate for a teenage boy.  Put the text choice as "Masturbation?"  or "Intercourse?"

    9/11 was the Neocons' Reichstag fire.

    by Bulldawg on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:58:41 PM PDT

  •  Rove probably stayed up all night (none)
    thinking this one up....

    And Frist.  He can't be this stupid -- so he just must be this evil..

  •  Dems need to name the beast for what it is (none)
    Democrats need to break the link Frist is making to Christianity.

    Eliminating the filibuster is a power grab.

    Frist is invoking Christianity to cynically manipulate the faithful.

    Democrats should not acknowledge that there is an issue of faith here. This is about politics. Frist wants power and he's willing to "push the buttons" of the faithful to get it.

    Bloggin Blagojevich's Blunders: do you want to see Roddy B challenged in the Dem Primary?

    by Carl Nyberg on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 12:59:10 PM PDT

  •  Hello 2006. (none)
    Actually, I think we should all send thank-you cards to Senator Frist for doing such a good job for Democrats in 2006.  It should probably read something like, "you're the best player on our team."

    What do you think?

    •  Um, every single thing we think will hurt them (none)
      helps them. They know their shit. This stuff works.

      George Bush prancing on the aircraft carrier: one of America's worst moments

      by grushka on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:00:18 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  There goes a point in time (none)
        when the old bag of tricks just won't work anymore.  While I realize your cyncism/ pessimism is well placed, I do think that the American people will see right through all of the games that Bush has been playing for the last few months.  Look at the scorecard:

        Social Security - Nothing
        Terri Schiavo - Nada
        Nuclear Option - Nope
        ANWR - Pure stupidity
        Bankruptcy Bill - See above

        Not exactly something I would want to run-on as a Republican in 2006.

    •  It will only hurt them if we push it (none)
      And stand for our principles, and force the Dems to do the same.

      I'll settle for handing Frist is a pink slip, or a subpeona...

      "Think. It ain't illegal yet." - George Clinton

      by jbeach on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:20:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Shortsightedness (none)
    It's fascinating how obviously shortsighted the current Republicans are.  They're willing to completely throw away well-established general principles simply because those general principles work against them on their particular specific pet issue of the day.

    It doesn't take a genius to realize that throwing away general principles because of specific instances will have unintended consequences.  Do they honestly not see that?

    It's not just this case.  The Schiavo case was very similar, as are the various anti-gay marriage proposals/laws going around.  And probably more things too.

    Seriously, are they really blind to this? Regardless of whether you believe that Roy Moore should go to the Supreme Court or whatever, completely trashing well-established general principles in order to get one very specific thing done is just... well, stupid.

    •  It's not just one thing (none)
      This will let them do whatever they want. Judges are the refs of American society. own the refs, and you can legislate whatever you want.

      Wnat to outlaw blasphemy? Make homosexuality a criminal offense? Turn public schools into bible camps? This is how you do it.

      George Bush prancing on the aircraft carrier: one of America's worst moments

      by grushka on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:01:59 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Why does this kid's face... (none)
    ...remind me of the second oldest son from Malcolm in the Middle?

    (I have a duaghter who watches this every day, OK?)

    "Nothing is as difficult as not deceiving oneself" - Ludwing Wittgenstein

    by Palamedes on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:00:42 PM PDT

    •  I thought the same thing (none)
      Does anybody have a good picture of the constitution for that picture?

      put it in his right hand

      "Our country right or wrong. When right, to be kept right; when wrong, to be put right" - Carl Schurz

      by RBH on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:06:47 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  who are the swing votes? (none)
    Which Republican Senators can be swung on this?

    How should the list be prioritized?

    Bloggin Blagojevich's Blunders: do you want to see Roddy B challenged in the Dem Primary?

    by Carl Nyberg on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:00:58 PM PDT

  •  Theme (none)
    The poster obviously states that Public Servants do not have faith in Christ.  Therefore, clearly federal employees are those hairy simian anti-Christ Secular Humanists who are out to convert your women and take your jobs.
  •  Their Christ is a Roman. (none)
    The Roman Empire:

    1. Tolerated (encouraged?) deviancy in their leaders

    2. Engaged in wars of choice/conquest for fiscal gain

    3. Distracted the masses with meaningless spectacle, while matters of importance were kept from public view

    4. Glorified bulimics (Schiavo)

    5. Sought to persecute religious beliefs that conflicted with their own, and prevented those who did not share that faith from holding office

    And here I've kept thinking that what the Repubs wanted to emulate was the Nazis. Maybe it's more old-school than that.


    Visit htttp:// for all of your Dave Mountain needs.

    by DMtShooter on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:06:21 PM PDT

  •  The God Bar ...... (none)
    What I fear is any person running for office or wants to promote a judge for higher office is going to have to pass "The God Bar"....Do you believe in a God?  How often do you go to church? Abortion? Gay Rights?  Stem Cell Rearch?  Will these questions or some of them gradually pop up more and more at Committee Meetings, Press Confrences, Political debates?.
  •  Here is FRC's phone number (none)

    Do something about it...

  •  The church is Highview (none)
     Highview Baptist Church's  "East Campus" in Louisville Kentucky.
    That is not the major mega church in Louisville. In fact I don't think many refer to it as a mega church.
    Little political pull. I wonder why they could't get a real mega church?
  •  Once again, (none)
    the GOP defiles Jesus. Why does Bill Frist want to nail Jesus to his own, Frist's, cross now? Apparently Bill didn't understand what it meant the first time and still doesn't.

    The poster clearly bears false witness against many. It would be nice to see someone religous on TV this weekend ask Bill Frist to repent for this sin.

    Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it. -Tom Paine

    by Alumbrados on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:09:29 PM PDT

  •  secede (none)
    we should secede.  let people govern themselves the way they want.
  •  This is a job for the VLWC! (none)
    We are all aghast and find the poster highly offensive.  Yet, we all know that it will be highly effective with the fundies and will further "anti-religious" labeling with respect to Democrats among the MSM and the public at large.  That's what really pisses us off.  Rather than just be pissed, we need to turn this against them.

    It will require coordination.  We need respected religious leaders - of all faiths - to voice their objections against the poster and the message it represents.   We need to confront moderate Republicans about this and get some really good equivocating responses in print.  There also needs top be a highly marketable party message that does not alienate people of faith - i.e., "Our courts, our system of democracy and our ability to worship as we choose should not be captive to the fundamentalist few" - something like that with good flow and little alliteration.  Then, back up the message with intelligent analysis from respected politicians - i.e., discuss just how radical and offensive the group is and the ramification if we were to adopt/implement their views.  Finally, go for the knock-out... mock them (would need some liberal leaning comedians/commentators to take care of this, but only after stage is set)!

    OK, VLWC... we are you?  Can you do this?    

  •  212.393.2100 (4.00)
    Just called and told the woman on the phone that as a Buddhist, I am deeply offended. That one can have faith (any faith) and still be in public service. Our country was not founded to be under one "official" religion and how DARE they assume that the fillibuster was against any religion.

    I then reminded her the reason we went to war in Afghanistan was because the government subjected everyone to their warped view of a single religion.

    I think I caught her by surprise.

    "Leadership and learning are indispensable to each other." - JFK

    by jillian on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:14:06 PM PDT

  •  I can do photoshop too (4.00)

    Truth doesn't take sides

    by KingJames on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:16:18 PM PDT

  •  Nice positioning of the FRC logo (none)
    Why that is just where his....  Well, for shame!  Those dirty minded cretins.  Gosh, I hate sublimidible advertising.
  •  time for war on superstition (4.00)
    I was raised by good Southern Baptists (missionaries, no less) and so I've always tried to sympathize a bit with superstitious people. But more and more I find myself attributing all the ills of American society to the masses of individuals who cherish "belief" above actual facts.

    So I'm ready to march in the streets against superstition. I want to vote for candidates who repudiate the idiocy that masquerades as spiritual wisdom. I don't want to debate politics with these people, I want to debate the existence of a God who has any effect on history.

    I've had enough of these people dragging Jesus' poor name into every goddamn issue. The guy is dead, and if they haven't been able to find anyone as good in over 2000 years, there's probably something wrong with their system.


    •  Good strategy? (4.00)
      The Republican Leadership manufacturers a false choice between religion and the judiciary.

      They do it to convince their base this is a religious war on Christianity.

      And your proposal is?

      Start a war on Christianity.

      We can't get our message out about the bankruptcy bill and the estate tax.

      And you think we can win a war against Christianity?

      Rove doesn't have be a genius if he can get us to do his dirty work.

      I understand your rant, but it isn't really religion that's the problem.

      The faithful call themselves sheep and lambs.

      We should deal with the false Shepards.

      You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him. --James D. Miles

      by Yaright on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:14:28 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Not Christianity, but Fascism is at work (none)
      when we see a poster like this.

      UpstateNYDem--in yesterday's diary "This should terrify everybody"--caught this quote by Tom
      De Lay that crystallizes a good part of American fascist ideology.

      It's the combination of church/state issues with other ideological concerns that makes it hard to convince a majority of Americans that we are dealing with fascists.

      Here is Tom De Lay's version of American history.
      Note that De Lay is really attacking close to 200 years of Constitutional traditions:

      I blame Congress over the last 50 to 100 years for not standing up and taking its responsibility given to it by the Constitution. [1] The reason the judiciary has been able to impose a separation of church and state that's nowhere in the Constitution is that Congress didn't stop them. [2] The reason we had judicial review is because Congress didn't stop them. [3] The reason we had a right to privacy is because Congress didn't stop them."

      I numbered the strands of valid political discourse that, entwined and "fixed" by De Lay and his faction, might allow a powerful few to transform our weakened Republic into an Empire.

      No right to privacy! No Conressional law made unconstitutional! Any American citizen, conservative or liberal, with any sense should be angry.

      Why do Republican leaders trust Tom De Lay and his followers? After all, they work with him: voters only know Tom De Lay from a few T.V. spots, and the recommendation of their leaders and newspaper editors.

      Let's put this poster in context. The gavel they are reaching for would quash "liberty and justice for all." We need to remind voters of the REST of their radical agenda when talking about this poster.

      Write letters to the editor! Speak up at local meetings! Call the politicians that represent you! Talk with your neighbors--NOW is the time to act.

  •  I'm a Christian... (4.00)
    And that's what prompted me to be a Democrat. Care for the poor, the sick, the oppressed, and the downtrodden. That's why I do public service.

    There are still Pharisees among us, it seems.

  •  Help! (none)
    Can we organize calls to the DNC to demand they speak out.

    I want to do something. These freaks have be a bit nervous.

  •  But.... (none)
    But why does one have to chose? Isn't that the whole point of being American? Everyone can be whatever they want as long as they play by a few ground rules.
  •  Each day I pray (none)
    That the Rapture comes and God takes these children of His back. But I know within my soul this will not happen. I love God but not this god that perverts justice to hate and love to greed.
  •  I made the mistake (none)
    Of clicking on the FRC website and reading the review of "Getting it Straight." Man that's some vile hate they're spewing.
  •  Like Bill Mahar says: (none)
    "When did this country turn into Utah!?!?!?"
  •  Pity the poor christain gop (none)
    They have the White House, all of Congress, 7 of 9 Republican-appointed Supreme Court justices, a majority of the judges appointed on the federal level, a majority of Governorships, a majority or state legislatures and they still are oppressed.

    God told them they should have total, absolute power to put his laws in place and that if the filibuster is still allowed for Democrats when they are in the minority, hellfire is on its way.

    A nation afraid of the world cannot lead it. JW

    by Velvet Revolution on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:30:16 PM PDT

  •  Rapture Right Here and Now! (4.00)
    SCENE: (The floor of the U.S. Senate)
    VOICEOVER / Rod Serling:  This is Bill Frist; age, fifty-two. A doctor and a powerful member of a boy's club who's decided their treehouse is the whole world.

    Cheney:  The Chair recognises Mr. Frist.

    Frist:  Thank you, Mr. President. I wanted to say publicly to my colleagues that America needs us to join prominent persons of faith in a struggle against those forces in this country who discrimininate against them -- who will not acknowledge that the time when god's people will be called home in a blinding moment of transport to heaven is upon us...

    VOICEOVER / Rod Serling:  Now things of this world may not be enough for Bill and his friends. But - Memorandum To The Chair: Be careful what you wish for.

    [Skip To The End Of The Episode; The Rapture Has Taken Place; Frist Has Been 'Whisked Away' To 'Someplace Else'...]

    SCENE: (Frist, in a street filled with people, surrounded by buildings of every kind and style; he is being passed on all sides by a babbling crowd from every historical age.  Frist is shouting up at a one of the windows in a building, where we see a man who looks like Thomas Jefferson.)

    Frist:  ...I don't understand! What is going on here??

    Jefferson: You are in heaven, sir; or, what passes for it.

    Frist:  But that's impossible; this isn't what heaven is supposed to be like! It's crowded, it smells, you're the only one I've seen who speaks English!

    Jefferson: One man's heaven, sir, may be another's hell.  Good day.

    Frist:  What??  WHAT??

    VOICEOVER / Rod Serling:  Bill Frist; age, fifty-two. Formerly a powerful member of a select group of true believers who thought believing in a lie would make it real.  Now a worried and angry resident -- in the Twilight Zone.

    What Do We Want?
    PEACE !!

    When Do We Want It?


    by WM Nelson on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:30:42 PM PDT

  •  I hate religion (none)
    and what its done to this country. Christ never promoted religion, he promoted faith, hope and charity. The religious right zealots have vilified my faith, which is a very personal decision and relationship and made it a weapon against me and 49% of this nations people. As they've sucked the life out of this, my beloved county, for personal gain, I've watched millions of Americans lose hope and our charity is disappearing. THERE IS NO JUSTICE IN THEIR BRAND OF CHRISTIANITY!
  •  Caption? (none)
    "Public Service? Faith in Christ? Nah. With these great minitures, I wanna be a poster-boy for extremists."

    "Mr. President, I'm not saying we wouldn't get our hair mussed." General Buck Turgidson

    by muledriver on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:35:53 PM PDT

  •  EeeEEW! (none)
    A few years ago I knew a born-again Christian who said he was afraid of religious persecution, and that Christians were the only people others could make derogatory comments about & get away with it - that the public attitude toward Christians was like the attitude toward Jews in Germany before the Holocaust. Of course he didn't know what he was talking about, but that is what he thought.
  •  We need to start calling these sons of bitches (none)
    what they are: religious bigots.

    What right do these assholes have telling Christian Democrats that they're not really Christians.

    This is going too far.  The Evangelicals are a bunch of corrupt Boss Tweed bullies.  Bullies who portray themselves as victims.  Whiners.

    •  And... (none)
      Jesus Wept! I do not think he can stop crying over this outrage! Something Jesus preached against and could not stand were those who loved money more than their fellow man , those who discriminate, those who are self righteous, judgmental, and those who are falsely pious.
      ( sounds like the right wing religious faction )

      " Woe to your scribes and Pharisees"

      " It is easier for a Camel to go through the Eye of a Needle than for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of Heaven".

      " You will not Make a Mockery of my Father's house" ( as he overturned the moneychanger's tables in the Temple)

      We choose hope over despair; possibilities over problems, optimism over cynicism.-John Edwards

      by wishingwell on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:46:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Let's get it on (none)
    This would be a good time to take the damn Bibles from Court, and when you have to promise to say the truth hold the Penal Code or the Constitution.
  •  Special place in Hell (none)
    If there is a Hell after Death, there is a Special Place for those who use God to gain power, manipulate people politically, and to spew hate in the His name.

    In the meantime, these religious right wing nuts are hijacking the Christian faith and making us Live Hell on Earth.

    We choose hope over despair; possibilities over problems, optimism over cynicism.-John Edwards

    by wishingwell on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:39:07 PM PDT

  •  He should not have to choose (4.00)
    faith for me, or for my brothers and sisters, in faith, or in doubt, believer or unbeliever, Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, Taoist, atheist, pagan, agnostic or Zoroastrian. He can choose his own faith, because we still, I think, have freedom of religion in this country and it is too important a right and privilege to give up lightly.

    But if he chooses to be a public servant, he must uphold the law, and not judge differently either because of his faith, or because of the faith of the person he is judging.

    Democrats give you the Bill of Rights; Republicans sell you a bill of goods!

    by barbwires on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:41:27 PM PDT

  •  Call to Action (none)
    I have posted a Diary "A Call To Action April 18, 2005" to get behind an effort to push the Democrats to fight back. Please help come up with ideas to organize.
    •  Call To Action - Face to Face (none)
      Maybe another idea for this call to action is to combine it w/the pastordan idea, where he is getting people to write out their own feelings on this subject, and I say we hand deliver them to Congress..either at their local offices and/or in Washington. DFA is doing that over the last couple of days w/their social security stories and if say a few hundred people show up on each Congressperson's doorstep, (regardless of their party but especially if thy are (repubs) that can hardly go un-noticed. Have them tell us to our faces that we are not people of faith.
  •  He Shoudl Not Have to Choose (none)
    A nation of laws not men...


    A big invisible man in the sky who inflicts pain and sufferieng and disease and death because he loves you...

    Tough choice.

    I knew Ted Hitler. Ted Hitler was a friend of mine. Ted Hitler ate my panda. You're no Ted Hitler.

    by nightsweat on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:44:36 PM PDT

  •  He doesn't *have* to choose! (none)
    You can believe in any religion you want, but if you're in a position of governmental authority, you are not allowed to bend the law to support said beliefs. Is this really such a hard concept?
    And check the bottom of the poster. This fine organization is run by Norman Bates!
  •  Photoshop Op... (none)
    Seems to me that there's an opportunity here for removing the kid... and sticking in an image of Osama.

    What goes with the question marks?

    And shouldn't it be "Injustice Sunday"?

    "Too many policemen, no liberty; Too many soldiers, no peace; Too many lawyers, no justice." Lin Yutang (1895-1976)

    by ogre on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:46:53 PM PDT

  •  This is a 5 minute Photochop (4.00)

    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." - Cicero

    by KOWALSKI on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:47:16 PM PDT

  •  as I recall (4.00)
    Judge Greer's church chose for him, not the other way 'round.
  •  Perhaps the response is simpler (none)
    Just "He should not choose between..."

    "Too many policemen, no liberty; Too many soldiers, no peace; Too many lawyers, no justice." Lin Yutang (1895-1976)

    by ogre on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:48:11 PM PDT

  •  Let them have their way! (none)
    Please stop trying to prevent the ultra-right from getting their way.

    If we can all just bite our tongues and let them move forward with their agenda, they will do more to help hasten a massive shift to the left in this country.

    by worker on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 01:49:24 PM PDT

  •  I Do Not Agree..Respectfully (none)
    Or we could end up in re-education camps asking ourselves why we didn't do anything.
  •  Only one thing is obvious (none)
    These folks have no faith in Christ, they have no idea what the Bible says and do not follow the words of Christ. They really are following false prophets.

    There was a period in the US in the early 1800's that exploded with evangelicalism and religious mystism. New religions sprang up all over the place -- most failed over time. There where preachers all over the place, many if not most with no theological training -- anyone could become one. It was said that there was not a single preacher west of the Mississippi with theological training.

    Many of these "Christian" preachers used the Bible, but they read from it with no founding in a traditional church, neither Catholic or any of the Reformed Churchs (Lutheran, Anglican, etc.) they just made it all up as they went along. This created a warped brand of "Christian" that is so very unchristian, this is the foundation of the evangelical movement. So, you see, their preachers really are false prophets.

  •  Photoshopped? who cares - God is the issue (none)
    1] there is a God
    2] ignore God to our peril
    3] Bush's war ignored God

    Well maybe Bush didn't since Bush's God is money.
    In the GOP money is more important than God, that's what we have to worry about.

  •  Get Whoopi on the phone..... (none)
    She mentioned in her HBO special about how proud she used to be of America, as opposed to Nazi occupied Holland, because she knew that people would never come and knock her door in because of her religion, her race, or her sexuality.

    Her wistful recollection made me realize how much we've lost.

    We need our own campaign, on the same day, to tell these fuckers to go to hell.  How about a rally in Washington, DC?

    Back in your holes, holy rollers!

    What is essential is invisible.

    by bebimbob on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:00:00 PM PDT

    •  I Agree (none)
      I am new to the blogs, however I want to do something. I share the frustration of many who feel that the Democrats are too timid to act on this.

      I had suggested a day of pressuring the DNC to act and to focus efforts unlike the 'call your member of congress ' routine.

      Are there experience bloggers and organizer out there who can help come up with ideas. I could care less about photoshop. I do care about acting. I don't mean to be preachy, but I feel like we should be doing something.

  •  Hey.... (none)
    ....I think I saw this kid in "Frat Boyz in Bondage"!  (I'd have to see him naked to tell for sure.)
  •  All this kid in the ad needs to know (none)
    is that he's free to believe whatever he wants, and to live his life accordingly, as long as he doesn't impose his beliefs on others in violation of the law.

    And if he doesn't like the law of the land, he can either work to change the law or he can move to Iran.

    Defeat the sound-bite.

    by sbj on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:03:15 PM PDT

  •  Has anybody had any beneficial experience... (none)
    ...getting mainline churches to be willing to discuss/counteract this?

    My congregation (Lutheran) willingly sends volunteers and cash to a rural community in El Salvador, works a lot with homeless women in downtown Seattle, and is trying to create, slowly, quietly, a "relationship neutral" policy towards accepting couples into the congregation (I noted that we were having a much harder time being an acceptable church for unmarried straight couples than for gay couples, and this idea, more digestible to gay-nervous members, was the result...), but when I try to get them to confront more about giving voice to where mainline Protestants differ from these folks when it comes to the intersection of politics and religion, they get cold feet awfully fast.

    I'd love to hear where such ideas as those put forward by this poster above are being effectively counterattacked.

    "Nothing is as difficult as not deceiving oneself" - Ludwing Wittgenstein

    by Palamedes on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:06:09 PM PDT

    •  Mainline Churches are Fighting Mad (none)
      Americans United for Separation of Church and State and the Interfaith Alliance have been all over this, and will continue to be.  

      They could use a little help.  Letters to the Editor from outraged people of faith aould be a good start.

      God and ego are not equivalent expressions of reality.

      by Othniel on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:20:34 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Christianity - (none)
    Lest we lose track of how ludicrous ANY discussion with or about "these people" can be:

    The entire religion hinges on one thing... A Talking Snake!

  •  Enough about photoshop (none)
    If you'd like to hear me rant about Bill Frist and this whole process, check out my blog. As you can tell, I held back a little.

    No one loves armed missionaries.

    by holycheebis on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:08:00 PM PDT

  •  Impeach judges? I want to impale them! (none)
    No,  those aren't words from a freeper in the midst of a flame war rant. This is what a "respected" conservative speaker told Max Blumenthal, our mole on the "Confronting the Judicial War on Faith" conference

    In Contempt of Courts | Max Blumenthal

    Michael Schwartz must have thought I was just another attendee of the "Confronting the Judicial War on Faith" conference. I approached the chief of staff of Oklahoma's GOP Senator Tom Coburn outside the conference in downtown Washington last Thursday afternoon after he spoke there. Before I could introduce myself, he turned to me and another observer with a crooked smile and exclaimed, "I'm a radical! I'm a real extremist. I don't want to impeach judges. I want to impale them!

  •  This is so fucking ridiculous (none)
    ...that it makes my head hurt. It's so fucking ridiculous that it makes me wish I COULD give up. This is so fucking ridiculous...

    ...I feel like I'm watching a movie about someone else's nightmare.

    I wish it were.


    Signed - The Patriotic Kossacks for the Happy American Dairies Initiative (e.g, bumping the # of recommendeds to 20)

    by cgilbert01 on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:11:28 PM PDT

  •  The Dark Ages Are Coming Back (none)
    Apparently one of the Religious right's thrusts will be to paint Texas Supreme Court Associate Justice Priscilla Owen as a persecuted Sunday School teacher who is being denied a seat on the Fifth Circuit becuase of her faith.  I believe they are really going to overplay their hand with this, like they did with Shiavo.  We have to ready for them.

    I do not think most Americans want to be compelled to attend Sunday School, and we need to be ready to show all our friends that this is exactly where we are headed if the Christian Nation people get their way.  There will be more government intervention in more areas of your life.  They will be in your hospital room, your bedroom, your child's school and your workplace.

    Control, control, control.

    It is not about their Freedom of Religion, it is about their ability to make everyone conform to their religion, and to embrace their puny, static, impotent version of a god small enough to be subject to their control.  I am a moderate Baptist, and I am not willing to exchange my dynamic and living God for their dead one.

    Priscilla Owen is the Church Lady, and if she is on the Fifth Circuit she will be teaching Sunday School in the French Quarter with unmitigated zeal, backed by the full force of the federal government.  The Puritans are coming, and the Church Lady is planning to be the new Grand Marshall, riding on the only float allowed in the parade.

    God and ego are not equivalent expressions of reality.

    by Othniel on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:15:42 PM PDT

  •  Isn't he too young to be a judge? (none)
    Maybe I'm wrong, but little Johnny here looks way too young to be a judge.  If he's one of the nominees its no wonder the Democrats in the Senate are so opposed to him.  Imagine 50+ years of this kid on the federal bench.
  •  Poor Poster Kid. (none)
    Poster Kid just needs a civics class. If he thinks America's laws run contrary to God's laws, he doesn't want to be a judge. He wants to be a legislator, an appointed official, maybe even President. One of the people who's empowered to rewrite the laws of America.

    But why would he want to be a judge? A judge's only job is to interpret the laws as they stand. How's Poster Kid going to bring America into line with his faith if he's just a legal functionary? He should REALLY have faith, and try to fix the whole damn system in the way the Constitution says it can be fixed.

    Why become a judge just to ignore the duties of a judge? That's... how can I say it?... faithless.

    We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. - Anaïs Nin

    by Valentine on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:17:36 PM PDT

  •  Terrified (none)
    Does anyone here ever fucking do anything. I am new to the blog world, but I thought is was part of a revolution.

    Will we fiddle as Rome burns?

    I am really upset by this. I feel the Dems have no balls and they need to a big push. As a gay man I am terrified that these people are going to win.

    2000 - We thought there is no way these guys can win

    2002 - We thought the party in power always loses during the midterms

    2004 - No way this guy can get re-elected with the war and a shit economy.

    THEY ARE WINNING! THEY KEEP WINNING. Anyone who thinks that these wackos are just going to go away is mistaken.

    I apologize for the anger. It's been a long week and I'm terrified.

    •  Blogs... (none)
      represent a new, revolutionary form of political communication.

      The action still happens in the real world, just like in olden times.

      The only thing that is different is that we can link up and hang out together and commiserate and inform and inspire each other a bit easier.

      The actions we take in our lives are still the most important thing, but you have to admit, it's nice to have such an easy way of keeping in touch.

    •  Terrified? what the hell can happen? (none)
      Why the hell are so many afraid? What the hell can happen?  

      The only thing that bothers me is that the Democrats keep putting up a'holes like Kerry who vote with Bush and would change nothing if they were elected.  The war keeps going and the economy sucking trade deficit mounts and there is no Democrat voice.

  •  Someone help me here (none)
    Call me stupid, I can take it.

    I just do not understand what the connection is?  How is trying to keep the fillibuster in any way involved with faith/religion?  

    I don't get the link...

    "Revolutionary change does not come as one cataclysmic moment...but as an endless succession of surprises, moving zigzag toward a more decent society."

    by saint on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:20:02 PM PDT

    •  They want faith-based judges (none)
      and they have been led to believe, by Delay et al, that the judges waiting to be confirmed are going to help overturn Roe, and reinstate laws against sodomy.

      They are waiting for the next supreme court appointment, and Bush will give them someone just henious, but this person will be confirmed if there is no filibuster.

    •  Strategy (none)
      1. Republicans want control of the judiciary.
      2. They need a groundswell of public support to free their senators to vote how the party wants them vote without angering their constituency.
      3. Therefore, they frame (supposedly "liberal") judges as being opposed to religion.
      4. Dumb people get scared of judges stealing their Bibles and demand that their senators to do away with them.
      5. Republicans, fulfilling the will of the people, eliminate the judicial filibuster.
      6. Republican jam in all their nominees without opposition.  
      7. Republicans have control of all three branches of government.  Americans have squat.

      So, you're not stupid at all.  There is no connection worth speaking of.  It is an attempt to dupe the American public into handing over all the keys to the country.
      •  But the rhetoric is even worse (none)
        The filibuster was used, to great effect, to stifle civil rights laws.  Most disgustingly, the reason federal lynching laws weren't passed was b/c of segregationist senators, like Pat Robertson's daddy...but I digress.

        So the spawn of those segregationists...the DeMints (succeeded one), the Lotts (worked for one), et. al and their ideological bedfellows in the busy-body lobby are now saying 100 years later (in an ironic twist) that we should just get rid of that AWFUL filibuster, b/c a bunch of folks in the majority's shade believing in the majority's religion with the majority of power that they are somehow oppressed.


        "Sir, we've already lost the dock." A Zion Lieutenant to Commander Lock, The Matrix Revolutions

        by AuntiePeachy on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:06:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Rove is using them to install CORPORATE judges (none)
        These nutbar religious whackos are Rove's Marines: they are to take the Judicial beachhead. The occupying Army, however, will be corporate lobbyist judges. This is Rove's plan.

        I've read that both Republican and Democratic judicial appointees tend to become more Libertarian on social and personal issues the longer they serve. Note that the right-wing SCOTUS voted to strike down sodomy laws in Tejas, and a right-wing judge in Florida approved the Schiavo tube-pulling.

        However, Republican judges vote overwhelmingly in favour of corporations and industry, and against ordinary Americans. Democratic appointees have more of a moral conscience: they tend to uphold the rights of people versus the greed of corporations.

        And so you have it. Rove gets to have his cake and eat it too:

        1. he gets to shove through a bunch of industry lobbyists to greatly expand corporate power,

        2. he gets to push through a few whacko religious maniacs to satisfy the shock troops in time for 2006, and

        3. he knows that his corporate lobbyist judges will continue to enrage the religious maniacs for a generation, thus guaranteeing a continued supply of soldiers to fight for him against the judiciary... so he can in turn push through more industry lobbyist judges, etc etc.

        A perpetual motion machine for greed! Who'd have thunk it?
  •  Couldn't they at least have thrown a (none)
    minority or girl on the thing?  For god's sake, at least try to interest the people they want to court for the party...
  •  call your senators, reps,...Hell call W (none)
    Then call FARt or whatever they are called.  Remind them that these former Dixiecrats are the ones that used the fillibuster in support of the "natural order" and against the Civil Rights Act.  Hell, Falwell led protests against it in Richmond, VA himself.  

    I just spoke with a confused woman there who seemed to believe that Demo's were rejecting judges because of their Christianity.  She didn't know what a theocracy was.  She thinks she's working for Jesus.

    Call and talk to them all.  Be nice, don't cuss if you can help it.  Teach these people something.  Most of them don't know any better.  They're being used by those who want power and more money.  

    I had a thought that if Jesus ever did come back he'd head right over to Fucus on the Family with a whip.  Dobson would probally love it though.

    "It's been real hard, but I ain't in no ways tired yet" - can't remember who said it, but she was right then and is right now

    by stclement on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:32:46 PM PDT

  •  The Azores are nice this time of year (none)
    Can't we give these people their own island?  Then they can burn books, shun science and goosestep in circles screaming "Praise the lord" until their hands and feet start bleeding like the stygmata.  Then, the rest of us could get on with the work or building and advancing civilization.
  •  *Total Failure* (none)
    This 'campaign' will fail miserably with everyone except those who already believe the tripe.

    First, who's the audience? Is it kids who are considering becoming judges? Pretty damn small target. Is it people who vote? Is it conservatives?

    Second, did anyone do any market analysis? Is this issue, the way it's framed, of any concern to the average citizen?

    Third, what do they want people to do? There's no call to action. Is it a TV program? Do they vote? Is there a referendum? Do they call their senator? What are they supposed to do with this info? Does someone get voted off an island?

    The rethuglodites are already divided on eliminating the filibuster. One more squealing sycophantic ad isn't going to clarify anything.

    Additionally, by posing the question as an either/or, they force people to come to their own conclusion before any real argument is made -- and I'll bet that most people would say, "Who cares? If it's that big a deal, then don't choose either one."

    Most people realize their really are some mutually exclusive choices in life -- but not for one second do I believe this is one of them -- and most rational people will behave appropriately. Of course whining, self-centered, egotistical American Taliban extremists won't.

    Oh, and they don't even point out that it was the ultraconservative redneck Christians who abused the filibuster to protect racial discrimination. But then I guess those who abuse the rules are the ones that are most knowledgeable about how to circumvent them in the first place.

    Chaos. It's not just a theory.

    by PBnJ on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:38:20 PM PDT

  •  Osama bin Laden has won (4.00)
    We thought he wanted to fight a holy war against us, when he really wanted to start one between us.
    •  Totally agree (none)
      And in a sense, we are playing right into his hand.  After all, one of the most influential thinkers in modern Islamic thought, Sayyid Qutb, came back from Colorado SHOCKED SHOCKED SHOCKED that men and women danced together.  He then went back to Egypt and wrote about how America is a Satanic society and urged believers to strive toward greater purity in their own faith (otherwise known as Jihad).  But dancing!!  Just like the old Baptist joke!  So, in a sense, the religious right is playing right into Osama's playbook - an attempt to bring America closer to God.  Osama would definitely approve.

      But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket, nor breaks my leg.

      by calipygian on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:25:49 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  BRILLIANT!!! (none)

      "It's been real hard, but I ain't in no ways tired yet" - can't remember who said it, but she was right then and is right now

      by stclement on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:37:24 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Must get a transcript (none)
    ANYTHING they say, no matter how "out there" should be used as if the GOP leadership said it themselves.

    The GOP leadership is fully responsible for this travesty. The ownership society party owns these wackos.

    No matter how wingnutty, violent, ugly or stupid, whatever anyone speaking at this thing says, Frist might as well have said it himself.

    THAT is how we have to talk about this.

  •  Is it just Me (none)
    or do that kids hands look HUGE?  The gavel and bible are hovering over the kid's hands, and the edge of the gavel is really grainy.  Have these people heard of blurring?  Thats how i make my Dubya pictures with bongs and straws i find on the internets...

    "Yankee detectives are always on the T.V. / 'cos killers in america are workin' seven days a week"

    by Nuclear Tea Party on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:46:39 PM PDT

  •  The Constitution states in: (none)
    Article. VI.

    Clause 3: The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution;

    but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.

  •  An astrologer's view of April 24th (none)
    I ran across this letter sent in to NewsDissector from yesterday. (If you go look, make sure you look at the blog for April 15th.)

    (FYI: Danny Schechter aka NewsDissector is a journalist/filmmaker/writer of long standing. His blog, NewsDissector, is one of the most informative, well-researched and best respected news blogs I have ever encountered. If you like DailyKos, you'll like this site - try it out.)


    I was looking through a stack of astrology charts, (my 35-year collection). and noticed the terrorists are due again, (astrologers believe history goes in cycles), to strike America on April 24, 2005, which is Passover, in a couple of weeks. That's my prediction.


    Any terror attack on April 24 appears NOT to be explosion, fire, bullets, or bomb, but rather, something nonviolent. It's a time in Taurus, often related to banking and money -- might they close abruptly? or an all-out ATM hack, like in Ohio's paperless voting machines?


    I don't really believe in this stuff, but the coincidence was just too good to pass up. So I thought I'd pass it along.

    "If you think you can, you can. If you think you can't, you're right." - Mary Kay Ash

    by WildRice on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 02:49:45 PM PDT

  •  Enough about Photoshop (4.00)
    Please look at spending your energies on fighting this instead.
    •  My very reaction to reading this discussion! (none)
      I tried to imagine someone from Europe -- someone worried about the hard right turn in the US -- reading the comments about this horror.  Photoshop?  Who gives a damn!  What about America?!

      Thanks for the additional heads-up, MahFella!

    •  raising anew the question (none)
      as to whether republican support to keep the FEC from regulating blogs is grounded in idealistic advocacy of free speech.

      Talk about bringing the mountain to Mohammed.

      Ay yi yi...holy.fucking.shit.

      Comments referring only to ratings are a nuisance. Noise. They waste time and bandwidth. We're all dumber for having read them.

      by willowby on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:52:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Oh, wow! Good catch. (none)
      This puppy is worth a diary of its own.

      "All religions, all faiths support the Freedom of Speech Restoration Act" NOT
      A lot of churches and religious leaders don't want to get caught up at this political level.

      Practice absurdus interruptus - Support ePluribus Media.

      by Catte Nappe on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 04:26:45 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  He Should Not GET to Choose... (none)
    Rule of Law? or Theocracy?


    by Doug in SF on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:12:53 PM PDT

    •  I like Hobbes' choice better (none)
      Rule of Law or war of every man against every man.  THeocracy is such a tame word for wholesale slaughter.

      Might and Right are always fighting In our youth it seems exciting. Right is always nearly winning. Might can hardly keep from grinning. -Clarence D

      by Myrkury on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:28:53 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  I know of literally hundreds (none)
    of people who work in public service and they believe in Christ. We'll put a stop to that! I think these people want to be made fun of.

    They want the federal government controlling Social Security like it's some kind of federal program - George W. Bush

    by kitebro on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:26:24 PM PDT

  •  So the fundies want to be exempt (none)
    from the rules of Judicial Conduct?  Cool, I'm a lawyer and a S.O.B.- does that mean I'm exempt from the rules of professional conduct? Sweeeeet- wassat- the voice in my head just told me the G-d wants me to execute and sell bogus leins on Denny Hastert's vacation house.. nice...

    Might and Right are always fighting In our youth it seems exciting. Right is always nearly winning. Might can hardly keep from grinning. -Clarence D

    by Myrkury on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 03:27:19 PM PDT

    It is SERIOUSLY slowing down page load ... 97K .. it took 5 minutes for the page to load on my system (with DSL).

    At least 'Shop it and make it smaller!

  •  Hiding Behind a Theocratic Position (none)
    I think it a mistake to call First and the political in-crowd "Theocrats."   It is far more likely that they are Aristocrats masquerading as Theocrats.  I don't think they give two hoots and a howler about the religious right.  They what to turn the US into an Aristocracy and are using all this religious language hide their true ambitions.  
  •  sick, stupid and pathetic (none)
    I was somewhat prescient in 2000, when I told a conservative relative living in a blue state, that should W get elected we would become a Christian nation.
    Well, now I have to say we are not in a theocratic state, but in the four years hence, and with moral values a plus for his bid in 2004, the socio-political climate has certainly moved more in that direction.
  •  Just as an aside (none)
    how many posts and diaries have we had with the headline "And so it begins..."?

    It seems to me that every few days we're moved to comment on the beginning of something really bad.

    Sign o' the times, yes?

    •  Not Quite... (none)
      It's more like a sign of the end of times.  I still don't quite understand how people who call themselves "Christian" basically read only the Old Testament and the Book of Revelations and manage to forget about all that useless commentary in the Gospels.  The recorded words of the person they claim for their own  get lost amid the swirl of all of the pundits who came before and after.  Kinda like Faux News.
  •  Weak faith in Christ (none)
    Their faith in Christ must be really weak if public service is enough to make them lose that faith.
  •  A Trial Balloon Ad (none)
    Just like the AARP one of a few months ago.  We'll be hearing from this organization soon, as they make fodder out of our outrage, cynicism, etc.  Fox et al will be "reporting" that the left-wing blogs are all in an uproar.  
  •  A little late (3.66)
    but here's my quick and dirty photoshop:

    "Whoever controls the media, the images, controls the culture." - Allen Ginsberg

    by chi mai on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 04:29:22 PM PDT

  •  I haven't read the comments, but (none)
    I posted on this already at my blog, so just click the link and read, please.


    "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."-Benjamin Franklin

    by wolverinethad on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 04:30:05 PM PDT

  •  Sinclair tactics? (none)
    Can't we do something like we did when Sinclair was going to air that anti-Kerry show? That was pretty effective.
  •  Love it! (none)
    Reminds me of corncob pipe but without the corncob....
  •  Smokescreen (4.00)
    This campaign is because Satan's minions (oops...I mean fundamentalist Republicans) are running scared.

    And we shouldn't spend so much time joking about this.

    Repugs have righteous indignation down to a science, though there is nothing righteous about them.

    I saw some weenie on Ron Reagan's talk show this afternoon...he was saying that Democrats basically  have no religious faith....them's fighting words....I'm a Democrat and I'm a devout get-off-your-butt-and-do-something Christian.

    The garbage these fundamentalists are spewing has absolutely NO relation to the bible's message (or to any other holy book, for that matter).

    Here's my concern:

    Where's OUR righteous indignation?  How do we fight a smear like this?  I realize this is just a smokescreen to keep people busy while Georgie B. and co. continue to rape our country, and the rest of the world for that matter.

    It's funny talking about Photoshop and the kid's forehead and all that, but these Christian criminals are serious.

    Where's OUR ad campaign about OUR faith and OUR righteous indignation?  We need to think big picture here, or we're going to be screwed again in 2006.

    •  Step 1... (none)
      Where's OUR righteous indignation?  How do we fight a smear like this?  I realize this is just a smokescreen to keep people busy while Georgie B. and co. continue to rape our country, and the rest of the world for that matter.

      It's funny talking about Photoshop and the kid's forehead and all that, but these Christian criminals are serious.

      Recognize their framing, and reject it absolutely in any communication regarding the issue. So, for instance, never refer to them as Christian without sneer quotes, preferably prefaced with "so-called", or "self-styled", or "supposedly". Even if you are calling them criminals in the same breath.

      But best not to use the word at all; they want to identify their political faction with the most common religious identity in the country. Do not, under any circumstances, no matter the temptation, cooperate with them.

  •  focus, focus.... (none)
    The comments about photshop are entertaining.....  What we need now, though, is a coordinated message from the Dems speaking out against this theocratic filth.  Where are the Dems on this?  Where's Howard Dean?  I think the Dems should be all over the weekend talk shows with a coordinated message blasting Frist for hate speech.  Claiming that dems will block these nominees because they are prejudiced against people of faith is a disgusting outrage, and we need to stand up and fight.

    This a perfect opportunity to paint Frist as the phony he is.  We need folks like Wallis (God's Politics) to come out and speak against this blasphemy.  Secularists, separation of church and staters, and reasonable evangelicals need to speak out against this, and Dean needs to lead the way.  

    Failure to capitalize on this absurd opening Frist is offering us is a bad sign.....

  •  RAPE!!!!!!!!!! (none)
    Rape of the Constitution!

    Against silence. Which is slavery. - Czeslaw Milosz

    by Caneel on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 05:04:40 PM PDT

  •  Ahhhhhhh! (none)
    Can't he have faith in Christ and not force his beliefs on other people?

    If he was holding the Koran maybe it'd be more effective.

    What's so funny about Peace, Love and Understanding? - Elvis Costello

    by mungley on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 05:08:03 PM PDT

  •  Wipe the smile off Frist's face (none)
    lets see some TV ads of poor little defenseless cats being used for some of Frist's horrendous experiments? That should 'clip his wings!!!'
  •  Nah, this one is easy to fix.... (none)
    Same poster for Amish, Mormon, Catholic, Hindu, Sikh, Muslim....

    Truckle the Uncivil, Nullus Anxietas Sanguinae

    by Truckle on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 06:53:04 PM PDT

  •  If his faith is so powerful, why does he need the (none)
    ...government to prop it up? The reality, of course, is that despite political power disproportionate the their numbers, the "faithful" have not and cannot transform America into a theocracy. Indeed, theocracy and Capitalism are inconsistent, and the unholy alliance between theocrats and plutocrats will tear the Republican Party apart, unless of course the Republican Party tears the country apart first.

    "Men use thought only to justify their wrongdoing, and employ speech only to conceal their thoughts." Voltaire

    by chimpwatch on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 07:36:38 PM PDT

  •  Oh, why not (4.00)


    Corel PhotoPainted...just for fun...
  •  screw photo shop (none)
    use fireworks any way, this is what really gets me when it says "the filibuster was once abused to protect racial bias" tell me what planet is frist/delay from? why do the religous freaks wanna go back to the 17th century? someone tell me what do these judges stand for? you know what, I went and read some speaches by bill clinton, he is quite a going to church believing in god type of guy why the hell did they filibuster all of his court nominees? was it politics or was it faith, the republicans are justing using the religious right unbelievable how duped 50% of the voters can be
    •  How they get away with it (none)
      Most people don't keep up with what's going on in the world....unless it deals with Michael Jackson, etc.

      Repugs know that when you repeat an untruth enough times, it becomes the truth.
      And, just to make sure that it does, keep the Repug-dominated media outlets reporting on the important stories like the sexual preferences of fictional sponges.  

  •  free advertizing? (none)
    I'm just speculating here, but I saw this ad earlier in the New York Times today.  It was located directly off the tail end of the front page story on Frist's crusade on page A14, making me think that they ran it as part of the article and not as a payed advertisement, maybe someone who's not as lazy as I am can find that out, but if they didn't pay to get that in the NYT that would be rather distressing.

    "When I was a boy I was told that anybody could become President. Now I'm beginning to believe it."-Clarence Darrow

    by cwech on Fri Apr 15, 2005 at 10:23:02 PM PDT

    Kinda makes me hope the Rapture is right around the corner...
  •  will it backfire? (none)
    First, they claimed that un-reformed Social Security is unfair to Blacks.  The popularity in the reform tanked all over the Deep South.

    Now, if filibuster can be used to protect, say, racial bias, can it be so bad?  

  •  What the hell is wrong with having to choose? (none)
    When I grew up, a life in public service and a life of the cloth were, as they still are today, two diametrically-opposed career choices (neither of which fit my skills and aptitudes), and that wasn't considered a problem. Why this suddenly requires government intervention is utterly mystifying to me.

    I mean, if you want to proselytise, go for it, become a preacher. If you want to serve in the government, study law or polisci.

    The choice I faced at the age of the pictured young man was: a career in music, or eating. I chose eating. I regret that choice now, but I never felt-- and still don't feel-- that it's the government's job to eliminate the need for young people to have to make career choices. You makes yer choices and ya lives with 'em. Choose to be a preacher, or choose to be a judge. You can't do a good job of either if you're going to try to be both.

    Of course, I grew up in the era when football players played football, and baseball players played baseball, and nobody considered it possible-- or even a good idea-- to try to do both. There are always a few Rennaisance people who can dabble in lots of things and excel in more than one. But, again, it's neither a tragedy nor a violation of anyone's civil rights if you don't happen to be one of those people.

    Not to blame Deion Sanders for this, but even "Bo knows" thatcareer choices is a fact of life. You can't do everything you want. Jack of all trades is master of none.

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